Anderson and Elwood Bigpond

BM: (tape recording fumbling sounds) Now we'll start all over again. This is an interview with Anderson Bigpond and Elwood Bigpond on the family cemeteries that they know about as well as any other cemeteries that they might know about here in Creek County. Okay, Mr. Bigpond was telling about where your father was buried. That is over about two miles east and about a quarter to a half a mile north of the Mills Chapel schoolhouse. Is that right?

EB: Ehh, let's see--

BM: Right there by Little Deep Fork Creek--on the south side of Little Deep Fork Creek but it'd be on the east side of that road. [refers to map]

EB: I don't believe that's two mile, I believe that's a mile (coughs) coming 00:01:00from Mills Chapel, you come to the corner there--

BM: Come down, so that's two miles over there.

EB: Huh.

BM: That'd be--well that'd be a mile, actually, a mile over there.

EB: And where you turn in there to go--

BM: And the road goes north--

EB: --to Dub Bolin, that would've been a mile.

BM: --yep, right. A mile, okay, a mile. Okay, a mile.

EB: About a mile and--

BM: That's right. You're right.

EB: About a mile and--

BM: About a mile and a half it looks like.

EB: About a mile and a half, yeah.

BM: Okay. Then north up to just before you get to Little Deep Fork Creek, then on the east side of that road, is that right?

EB: Yeah.

BM: Okay. Now then, the Clinton Cemetery, that would be called the Clinton Cemetery.

EB: Yeah.

BM: Okay.

EB: As far as I know that's what's it's--

BM: As far as you know.

EB: Yeah.

BM: Okay, then the Bigpond Family Cemetery then, would be five miles east, a mile south--

AB: About a mile and a quarter.

EB: About a mile and a quarter.

BM: About a mile and a quarter south--

EB: Yeah.

BM: And east about a quarter of a mile.

AB: Yes.

BM: Is that right?

AB: That's right, about a quarter of a mile.

BM: Now we got that marked as Bigpond Family Cemetery." (pause) Alright, is there any of the--we were talking earlier about these, these babies that's buried out here. Do you want to put them on here? Or do we want to let them go? I'm going to leave that strictly up to you.

EB: It's not a cemetery but I don't know if they could--

BM: It's a family burial plot, isn't it?

AB: Yeah.

EB: Yeah.

BM: It would be a family burial plot.

EB: Mmm.

BM: So we're gonna mark this with a marker--

EB: That little baby here was, it died at birth.

BM: Okay. What we'll do with this one, then, we'll mark this one over here E-L-W-O-O-D Family Plot. [marks map] That would be this one right out here.

EB: Yeah.

BM: Okay, we'll call that one eighty-five and we'll mark that one right there eighty-five. [marks map] Well that's--we'll call that the Elwood Bigpond Family Plot. Okay, anything else that you can think of?

EB: No, I believe I don't.

AB: Now, how about the one north of you, where grandma lived, on the east there? 00:04:00Several graves in [indecipherable]?

EB: Two babies there. Two babies there but that's--that's been sold, too.

BM: Now, it don't make any difference about it being sold if there's two babies there. It's a family plot and as I say, what is got me stirred up on this thing and got me t'd off--I've run into one back over east of Kellyville over here, right there was a--it was a large graveyard and it was called the Bucktrot. Little Bucktrot. Over here east of Kellyville that the old boy'd just taken a bulldozer--

EB: Huh.

BM: --bulldozered all down, just pile the stones and everything up, went in and planted a garden on top of it. That burnt me up.

AB: That's not in there where--

BM: Now the Indian Nations Council, they've got a report of this as well as two attorneys here in Bristow and they say that they can be something done about that.

EB: Yeah. (rooster crowing)

BM: That a burial ground, regardless of where it is or what it is, is a sacred. If it's one or if it's 100, it's still sacred ground. (rooster crowing)

EB: That must've been Cunja (ph) Bucktrot's place north, kind of north of--

BM: Well it--go east out of Kellyville--

EB: East.

BM: East out--straight east get out of Kellyville out there, back out there on the hill. About a mile, mile and a half, mile east of Kellyville out there and 00:06:00then back south down there. I heard this from fellow by the name of Felix. (rooster crowing)

EB: Kenny (ph) Felix.

BM: I believe his name was Osc-Amos. Amos.

EB: Amos.

BM: Amos Felix.

AB: Yeah, we know him.

BM: Amos was telling me about this and I ran it down, and shore enough that's what's happening. (rooster crowing)

AB: This is not the cemetery that--what was their, Winnie Cahwey (ph) and--Winnie Cahwey (ph) and Pat Barnett, you know, they were always feuding over a cemetery up there that her grandfather Osa (ph) had plowed it up or something like that.

EB: This was out in a few minutes ago.

AB: Plowed it up and--

EB: Was trying to find the cemetery.

BM: You know anything?

UM: Not around this part [inaudible].

BM: Well alright, I'll probably--when we get this done, they're talking about they want me to take Okfuskee and also Okmulgee County and do the same thing 00:07:00with a bunch in there.

UM: Yeah. There's also one in Seminole County.

BM: Yeah? We have found eighty-five here in the Creek County area.

UM: Well there's a bunch of them that--

BM: And it doesn't make any difference whether it's a white cemetery, colored cemetery, Indian cemetery, family burial plot, or what.

UM: Mmm-hmm.

AB: Do you work for the Creek Nation? Or just working for--

BM: This is just for myself.

AB: Oh, I see.

BM: This is for myself. So we're the Genealogy Society of Bristow.

AB: Yeah. Well I thought that's what I read it in the paper and then--

BM: Genealogist Society in Bristow, they appointed me and the wife to run this all down and when we get this all run down it'll be put on a computer form. With 00:08:00the names of the cemetery and roughly how it's laid out, if it's taken care of, if it's got a fence around it, roughly how many graves is in it, the whole works.

UM: Gonna take a while isn't it? (chuckles)

BM: Well, you'd be surprised, I've already come up with eighty-five.

UM: Yeah.

BM: Here in Creek County. And I've been just damned near to all of them.

UM: Yeah.

BM: All but just this--this one back off over here that I found out about this morning, where his [Elwood's] dad was buried. I didn't know anything about that one.

UM: Yeah.

BM: And I didn't know anything about the family Bigpond--Bigpond Family Cemetery. I didn't know anything about that.

UM: Yeah.

BM: I heard about it yesterday evening but I didn't--I didn't know anything about it.

UM: Hmm.

BM: Gene Connolly's (ph) wife was telling me about this here [indecipherable]. 00:09:00And, well, there's not but one thing for me to do.

UM: [inaudible]

BM: (chuckles) No, I just go run down the man that--go down and run down the man with the plan.

EB: You know, this fellow, this Bigpond--there is a Bigpond Cemetery in Depew.

BM: Yeah, that's off over here. [refers to map]

EB: Yeah.

BM: That's way off over here. And there's also a Cawhey (ph) over there.

EB: Yeah.

AB: Yeah.

BM: There's Cawhey (ph) Cemetery over there as well as a Bigpond Cemetery over there.

EB: I believe they're together in there.

BM: Well, they're right there close together, just maybe [indecipherable] apart. They're all right there together.

AB: Now, Jack Tiger--what was, don't they have a--

EB: Jack Tiger's buried south of Depew kind of off in the woods there somewhere. It's an old cemetery right in there.

BM: South of Depew?

EB: Yeah.

BM: Okay, how far south?

EB: Well, let's see.

BM: I don't want you to go, getting' you all upset now, why don't you just relax. (all chuckling) I want you to relax.

AB: Now, I know, you could--now there's a girl, woman, lives over there. She's married to Jake Barnett. Now they live in Depew.

BM: No, I heard about them Barnetts live out here north of town.

AB: Well, that's some of the same family.

BM: Yes.

AB: But they live in Depew. Now that's--Jack Tiger was her dad, wasn't it? Jake's wife.

EB: Patti?

AB: Yeah.

EB: Patti and--

AB: What's Jake's wife's name?

EB: Patti and Jack Tiger.

AB: Is it Lodie Tiger?

BM: Otey?

AB: Lodie. Lodie Tiger.

BM: Lodie.

AB: But it's Lodie Barnett now. She's married to Jake Barnett. And they live south of Depew, not maybe about a mile south of Depew.

EB: That makes the cemetery on their place.

AB: Yeah, well, now, see, this is Barnett Cemetery I was telling you--

UM: [aside] I'll be back here after while.

EB: [aside] Okay.

AB: --Barnett Cemetery I was telling you about last night. [refers to map]

BM: Yeah.

AB: See, this is Barnett Family Cemetery. Now, Patsy Ruth Barnett, she was married to William Barnett. Now, this Cawhey (ph) and Pat (ph) were always kind of at odds with one another. And when--Pat told me, said the feud has lasted for a number of years on account of her grandfather had plowed up Mrs. Cawhey's (ph) 00:12:00grandfather, or something like that there. But I was wondering when you's telling about this over there at Kellyville that someone went in and dozed. And I just wondered if that's the same place or not.

BM: No, this one's over there south of Kellyville. This one over here, then, would be over here about a mile south, you said, about a mile south of Depew?

AB: Well, you can locate--

BM: This one here. [refers to map]

AB: You can locate--

BM: This one here.

AB: Well, I've been back in there now. I'm not too for sure. But you could contact--

EB: Lodie. She'll tell you about that, sure.

BM: Lodie?

AB: Lodie. Jack Tiger, where Jack Tiger's buried in that cemetery. Now I don't know the name of it. But Lodie Tiger--Lodie Tiger Barnett, could--she lives there and she could probably tell you more about that.

EB: Now, they tell me that a rancher bought that place and he--I don't know whether he plowed anything or not but he's pasturing it, pasturing it over there.

BM: Why that's--of course, pasturing it, that's not gonna hurt it or anything. Go in there and go to throwing them damn claw down that deep, why, a lot of them graves that--Lord, they's supposed to be four to six feet deep but now, you know 00:13:00as well as I do that, that there's some places here in this part of the country there's no way that you're gonna dig four to six feet deep.

AB: Yeah.

BM: So there's gonna be a lot of 'em it wouldn't be over two feet deep. The equipment they've got now a'days, well it's nothing for 'em to plow six--plow two feet deep. Or scratch two feet deep.

AB: Now I've got one here I'd like to ask you about.

BM: Alright.

AB: Since I, I usually save all these all the time. Okay. Now-- [papers rustling]

BM: Robert Biggs!

AB: Robert Biggs, now he was buried in Oakcrest Memorial Park, is that the same as the Bristow cemetery?

BM: That would be the Bristow cemetery.

AB: Well, you see why I was wondering about it [rooster caws] see I got one on Barney (ph) Harjo, now he's related to the Harjos live north of town so if it's Bristow City Cemetery [rooster caws] so I--

BM: Well, see, that'd be that Oakcrest, that would be the same thing. (pause) 00:14:00Now I think that's right but now I wouldn't say definitely sure.

AB: (chuckles)

BM: Now the reason I'm saying that is this: Now out here west of Bristow, stop and think a minute now, and you too, Anderson. Out here west of Bristow, now you know, they had the old Poor Farm cemetery, or pauper's cemetery, whichever one you want to call it, had them little crosses, sitting right there beside the road.

AB: Yeah.

BM: Alright, now right just up on the hill there, on the south side of sixty-six, now there is a graveyard there. But I have not been able to get any name on it.

AB: I think I know where you're talking about but I don't know too much about that.

BM: I don't either! I can't run anybody down that's got a name on it.

AB: You know out west of Bristow--

BM: Out there where that Deep Rock camp is out there west of Bristow?

AB: Yeah.

EB: What they used to call the Poor Farm?

BM: Yeah, the Poor Farm.

AB: Yeah.

BM: Alright, the Poor Farm graveyard is right down there beside the highway. They've got some little crosses in there on it.

AB: Just right on that--

BM: Right on the north side of the highway.

AB: North side. And all them little crosses there.

BM: All them little crosses there. Now just up about 200, two- or three-hundred yards right west of that on the south side of the road, in them trees, there is another cemetery.

EB: I've been by there but I wouldn't know.

BM: But I would say that this here [refers to map], I would say that's what this is right here. But I will check this out and make sure.

AB: You think it's the Bristow cemetery?

BM: Oakcrest Memorial.

AB: Now I got loooots of this stuff so I don't have to be guessing, I can tell you for sure (chuckles)

BM: I'll check this out and see where that Oakcrest is. And if it, if it is the 00:16:00old Bristow Cemetery, then it's out there by the armory.

AB: Mmm-hmm, yeah. I--since I was leafing some, going through some of these, I just kind of, well I know we got the Magnolia Cemetery and stuff like that.

BM: Oh, and 44, we've got the 44 out there, we got the Magnolia.

AB: Yeah.

BM: Really and truly that could be Harjo out there instead of Magnolia. But Roy Dunaway, when he put that thing in, he just got a hundred-year lease on it, he couldn't buy the land, he got a hundred-year lease on it and placed that cemetery there and that man has got rich on those graves.

AB: Yeah.

BM: Just on leased land. Well when that hundred year's up, now, here's the sixty-four-dollar question: Will the Harjo family renew the hundred-year lease? Will the Harjo family?

AB: But they never did buy that? They just got a hundred-year lease?

BM: They just got a hundred-year lease on it!

AB: Huh. That's interesting, ain't it?

EB: What cemetery's that?

BM: That's that Magnolia. That's that one north of town.

AB: They, they never did buy that. They just leased it for a hundred years, which I never, I didn't know.

BM: Now Roy Dunaway told me this himself before he died. And Roy and I was pretty close there at one time. And he told me when he first went to laying that thing out, goddamn Roy, you're, you're really sticking your neck out, ain't you buddy? And, oh, he said, I got a hundred-year lease on it for two dollars a year and I don't think I'm sticking my neck out very far, I said, No, I don't believe you are, either.

AB: But it's gonna complicate things in the future.

BM: In the future it's gonna complicate things.

AB: If you don't buy it--I mean if you try to buy it, say probably [indecipherable] (chuckles) and what's gonna happen to it (chuckles)

BM: Well, Ron Schumaker, whenever they, you go out there and buy a plot, they give you a deed to that plot.

AB: Yeah.

BM: Well now that deed is worthless as the paper it was written on, by it being leased land. There is no way that he can give a clear deed to that plot of ground. But he can write one up. Everybody doesn't know this.

AB: Now, this is south of town here, now. I thought that was the old Tiger cemetery, [inaudible] 'cause there's a lots of people buried there. Isn't Alma (ph) Tiger and Tom (ph) Tiger and all of them buried in there?

BM: Now, Flo (ph) Weaver told me that was called the Harjo.

AB: Well, they must've--see, that was there before the Harjos existed.

BM: That isn't very possible, is it? (chuckles)

AB: But I guess the Harjos, since they do bury there, I guess they--

EB: Clearly it's kind of family--

AB: Yeah, it's kind of a family.

BM: It's family. It's sort of a family.

AB: --could be called family.

BM: It's sort of a family get-together.

AB: 'Cause you see, my mother--my mother's mother, she's buried there, too.

BM: Wait a min-- Oak Hill. Okay now, we've got--I don't know whether you knew it--know it or not, now that would be out there at this new--that'd be out the new cemetery. Now there in Bristow they've got another cemetery that was the original Bristow cemetery. I didn't know whether you knew that or not.

AB: No.

BM: Now they, they've got another one, you go out east of Bristow on sixteen--

AB: Yeah.

BM: And you start down the hill there to cross Sand Creek?

AB: Yeah.

BM: Just before you start, just before you drop over that hump to go down to Sand Creek, that's straight south back up there, was the original old Bristow Cemetery.

AB: Hmm.

BM: And I've called it the Foster Cemetery but I didn't know at the time that it was the old Bristow Cemetery, because the reason I did that was Arthur Foster's grandfather is buried there and he's the one who's got the big stone. He's got a big stone.

AB: I didn't even know there was cemetery there.

BM: It's--would be located right here [refers to map].

AB: That would be kind of north--

BM: Right here. Right here. Right there is where it's located.

AB: Well it would be kind of located--well they got some apartment buildings there--

BM: Well, now, see, that's north of them apartment buildings.

AB: North of them apartment buildings?

BM: It's north of them apartment buildings. Now they tell me, I've been in there, the wife's got two uncles that's buried there in that thing.

AB: Mmm-hmm.

BM: That's what got us to really checking into it.

AB: Mmm-hmm.

BM: And then as times comes on, this was the original, the old Bristow Cemetery, before they moved out, out on the hill out there.

EB: Is that what they called the sixty?

BM: May be, I don't know.

EB: Right north of--two miles east of Bristow and then back north.

BM: No, this is just right, this is just--now is there one out there by sixty?

EB: Well, I don't--I've heard of people being buried out there.

BM: Out there by model sixty then.

EB: Yeah. You go two miles east and then north.

BM: Two miles east and go north up there.

EB: Right in there.

BM: I didn't know anything about that one. [refers to map] Okay, we go two miles east, be here, go north two miles and now then that road, according to this map, 00:22:00it don't show that that road goes all the way to there. But it does, it goes to and comes back out at the bottom of the hill over there, that's the Joe (ph) Allen (ph) place. It just winds around comes on around comes back to the old Joe (ph) Allen (ph) hill. At the bottom of the old Joe (ph) Allen (ph) hill.

AB: What did, did, oh--Pinehill. Did they have a cemetery?

BM: Yep. Sure did.

EB: Yeah, they cut one.

BM: They built one a way up here. And Sally Pinehill, she's buried way south of the old, the original. The one--the original cemetery, it's right up on the bank of Polecat. Remember where Pinehill schoolhouse used to be?

AB: Yeah.

BM: Okay, go east from Pinehill schoolhouse, you cross the creek, you go on down--the road is going straight there and the road comes right around the side of the creek. Just before you make that curve it's settin' right back south--southeast over there on the east side of that creek.

AB: I was pretty young, you know in those days, I don't remember--

BM: The the old Sally Pinehill, she didn't want--they didn't bury her down there in the old original, the old original cemetery.

AB: Hmm.

BM: They buried her back south of there about a quarter to a half a mile up on the side of the hill on her allotment up there. And you got the old Artie (ph) Skeeters (ph)--Artie Mosquito, do you remember him? Then you've got the old Artie (ph) Mosquito cemetery back over there on Mosquito Creek. pause Okay, now then, there's another question that been a'rubbin' me: I was called late 00:24:00yesterday evening about a cemetery. You go to Kellyville, go west out of Kellyville, to the first road that goes north. And that road goes all the way through to 33 Highway up there, and you come out up there at Bluebell. When you turn north up there--it's just about a mile north, just before you cross the turnpike up there. On the west side of the road there's supposed to be a cemetery sitting in there behind--according to this party that called me--there's supposed to be a cemetery in there. There's five or six graves in it. Do you know any of this?

EB: You get more information on that if you just talk to Joe Watashe right in there, he--

BM: Okay. Alright. Well now see, Watashe's got on up the road, on up the road, 00:25:00then, to the next mile section.

EB: Mmm-hmm.

BM: North of there, then a mile and a half west is where the old Watashe Cemetery is.

EB: Mmm-hmm.

BM: And the old Watashi stompground and so on and so forth in there.

EB: Yeah.

BM: Okay. Then. I don't know whether I've got this one right or not: You come back over to that road going on up there, up about a half a mile north of that road, now. There is one sitting back west of the road over there (chickens squawking). They say there's probably twenty-five or thirty graves in it.

EB: Mmm-hmm.

BM: But I didn't have a chance to go in and look this one over. It was wet and I didn't have a chance to go and look it over. But they tell me now that they call that one George.

EB: George.

BM: That's what I was told yesterday evening on this one. They call that one George. Do you know anything about that?

EB: No, but I know a few Georges. But I don't know nothing about a cemetery.

BM: Okay, let me backtrack here to sixty-five (pages flipping). I've got two here--see we're sixty-five out here. (chickens squawking) Okay, sixty-six, same way. Alright, now then. Sixty--I've got sixty-six (dog barking). Do you know anything about go down here to the, the road that goes across there at the airport? And go west, just before you get to the airport over there, on the north side of the road there. Do you know of anything right in there?

AB: That would be going on past the Kelly farm in there?

BM: Yeah, see, it'd be--it's right on the Kelly farm in there and then this plot laid right in there between the airport and the Kelly farm. Now I do know there's a dwelling, an Indian dwelling down there, but to tell you--I didn't even know--

EB: The only one I know was buried in there in the cemetery'd be Ed Harry.

AB: Oh! You got--have you got the Harry Cemetery?

BM: Alright, would that be it?

AB: You go up here to the three mile--

BM: Three miles?

AB: Let's see, let's see--be two miles out of town back off in this Deep Fork ridge.

BM: Yeah.

AB: And you go about a mile and three quarters--

BM: West.

AB: West.

BM: Okay.

AB: And that--it's got a big sign there, it did have a big sign, the Harry Cemetery.

BM: Okay, that's this damn thing I'm trying to find, that would be this, this 00:28:00sixty-six. Harry.

EB: Eddie Harry.

AB: Oh, and then there's Watson--one of those Watson girls was married, do you remember the one they called Salina (ph) died and [indecipherable]

BM: Okay, now, that would be--

EB: Did they bury her there?

AB: Yeah.

BM: That would be the Eddie Harry. That would be the cemetery that I'm talking about.

AB: Well, I think they just got Harry Cemetery.

BM: Okay, that's what we'll put down here. We'll put Harry.

AB: Yeah.

BM: Harry Cemetery down there.

AB: Now they--there's an old house sits kind of off in the woods by it, and now--right out there right alongside the road they did have a big sign that said Harry Cemetery. Big oh--big sign about like that yay. That just a little before, it's down--

BM: You come off that hill there and you drive, just before you get--

AB: Down at the bottom of that school there. What was school there?

BM: That was down, right on--going into [indecipherable] it was sitting up on top of the hill there.

AB: Yeah well it was down at the--you know where it's at, then, yeah.

BM: I've got that--I had it marked but I didn't have no name for it. Okay, sixty-five. Let me see where--let me run sixty-five down. I know there's another 00:29:00one in there. But I gotta find it.

EB: It looks right here, sixty-two.

BM: Yeah. (pause) Let me find sixty-five. [refers to map] I've had to come back in after--had to come back in and as they went to coming in I've had to come back in and remark everything. [murmuring] Sixty-five. (rooster crows) Scattered-the numbers are scattered everywhere. [murmuring] Sixty-eight. Sixty-four. Can't find it over here anywhere. Fifty-nine. (chicken squawking) 00:30:00No, I don't see it right now. Oh, yeah! Right here! That's the one over here just this side of Depew, now. You come around the curve coming out of Depew, come around that curve you straighten out in there right in there right south of that--well it'd be southwest of that salvage yard out there. (rooster crows) On the south side of the road. There used to be a sign up there. But the sign is 00:31:00gone. It's out there, see you come in there where that road goes south to Gypsy--

AB: Mm-hmm.

EB: That must be right in there by where old man Kilgore (ph) used to live.

BM: Yeah?

EB: South of there--

BM: It's out there south of the Kilgore (ph) place out there. Well, see, [indecipherable]--before the highway was finished in there, his son was killed out on that curve just east of the house, on that damned crooked-edge crooked curve in there. They tried to take that curve 'round--

[brief interference in tape]

BM: --but you have any idea what that cemetery would be?

EB: No, I don't. (rooster crows)

BM: That would be this one right here. [refers to map]

EB: Is it pretty close to the railroad?

BM: Yeah, it would be north of the railroad.

EB: No, way back there Jim Bigpond got killed on the railroad right there--well, he didn't die then, but he got his arm and leg cut off and he died later on, but I don't think he was buried there.

BM: But there used to be a big sign up there that--that sign is gone now.

EB: Yeah.

BM: But it's out there between Bristow and Depew.

EB: Yeah.

BM: Okay, let's see. I've got another one in here I think. Seventy-one. Where's seventy-one at? [referencing map] [mumbling to self] Sixty-five, seventy-one. Yeah, that's this one up here, we didn't know on the--still no name for that 00:33:00one, still no name for that one. Sixty-one was called George. Now this, this eighteen, we still haven't got a name for it yet. That's this one out here just the other side of [indecipherable].

AB: Seem like, wasn't there a sign up for that?

BM: There used to be a sign up there.

AB: Now, tell me something: where--I think there's a cemetery by the name of Haydenville or something like that, but it seems to me--I always see that come up [inaudible]

BM: Haydenville's way down south--

AB: Yeah, I know where Haydenville is. But I--seems like there's something right down here. Haydenville--might not've been. Hayden? Or [indecipherable] or something like that--

BM: I don't know what that name is right there, but--

AB: Yeah. Now, now they might have a cemetery in there, you know where the old Tuskegee School is?

BM: Yeah, the old Tuskegee School, here it is right here. [refers to map]

AB: You go out about a mile north--

BM: About a mile--

AB: Wait, no, about a half a mile north and then--

BM: Well then that's--

AB: Then about a quarter of a mile back east. Now there's a cemetery in there, too.

BM: Okay. McKnight.

AB: Knight.

BM: Knight.

AB: K-N-I-G-H-T. Now, I'm not too fam--I've been there, but I'm not too familiar.

BM: Okay, yeah, I know the people that's up there.

AB: Now where's the Bear cemetery out there?

BM: Bear?

AB: Yeah.

BM: Okay, I'll tell you in a minute. [refers to map]

EB: I saw them over here.

BM: You said over here, didn't you? Baker, Baker, Battle, Battle, Bucktrot, Tiger, Phillip, Harlinsville, Brown--well I had it here.

EB: [inaudible]

AB: The reason I was asking you, I got cemetery (rooster crows) Tuskegee there, that school in there--I was thinking was thinking that the Bear cemetery and it was the same place, but they said it's the same--

BM: No, it's not. That is the--where in the world's that at, I know it--I know Bear is on there. But I don't see it.

EB: I seen it a while ago somewhere.

BM: Wattie (ph) Sewell (ph), Lodie Tiger, Bucktrot, Gilcrease, Battle, Bucktrot, Baker, Drumright, Cawhey (ph), Washburn (ph), Brown, Bucktrot, Clinton--well 00:36:00here it is! Number three! The Bear! Be right here. [refers to map]

AB: Now let's see, this is--

BM: That's west, come right straight north of Tuskegee--

AB: Yeah.

BM: That would be out there, what is now known as the Juedeman place. Down there on the Juedeman place.

AB: Yeah.

BM: See, Roley Bear lived just before you get--Roley Bear's place was just before you get up to the Juedeman place.

AB: My sister's buried there.

BM: Yeah?

AB: Well I--

BM: Then on north of that, then, is the Juedeman place, it's back off out--it's back off out to the right back off out there.

AB: Mmm-hmm.

BM: Anything else you can think of?

AB: Now, Clarence--Clarence Brown, they have a cemetery there.

BM: Okay, now we've got, we've got a Brown. Another Brown. We've got a Brown here somewhere. [refers to map] Yeah, Teddy Brown. Old man Brown and we've got a Teddy Brown. Now, this is where names are a gift to me: seventy-three and seventy-six. Seventy-three and seventy-six. That'd be right in here. [refers to map] Seventy-three--(pause) and I don't--we've got Brown there but that's not right. Brown or Long over there south, Cawhey's (ph) in there, there's another one here.

AB: [inaudible]

BM: The old man Brown is down seventy-six.

AB: That would be--

BM: That would be down file miles south--

AB: Out east, east of Gypsy?

BM: Yeah. I gotta find it. Seventy-nine, I marked everything last night. Seventy-five, seventy-four and seventy-five. Alright, seventy-four is Teddy Brown.

AB: Ted Brown.

BM: Ted Brown. Seventy-five is Washburn (ph).

AB: Washburn (ph). That would be--

BM: [indecipherable] five miles, go straight east here [refers to map]--

AB: Yep. Two mile--three miles--

BM: One mile, then go straight south.

AB: Yeah, I know where it's at.

BM: Okay, Ted Brown is in there too.

AB: Is that where Teddy Brown lies?

BM: Yeah, yeah. Teddy Brown's in there too.

AB: Hmm. (chuckles)

BM: Okay, then, seventy-seven, it's back over here right west of Iron Post. That's the old Mason Bucktrot.

AB: Madison Bucktrot.

BM: Madison Bucktrot. And is that right?

EB: They got, they got their own cemetery.

BM: Okay, that's what we got it marked Madison Bucktrot. Okay. Seventy-eight--(pause). It's right in here because it was marked last night. Yesterday evening. Seventy-nine, we just marked that seventy-nine, the Clinton, in here. Seventy-eight. Well anyway, seventy-eight--we got the Lucy Deer (ph). 00:40:00The Lucy Deer (ph).

AB: Is that the same one they call Woosy Deer (ph)?

BM: Woosy (ph), that's it.

EB: Woosy Deer (ph).

BM: Woosy Deer (ph).

AB: Woosy Deer (ph).

BM: Woosy Deer (ph). Right it here it is, way up here.

EB: Oh, it's around Sapulpa then.

BM: Seventy-eight. That's up there by the turnpike gate out of Sapulpa. Seventy-nine is Lundsford (ph). That's right in here.

AB: Back in here.

BM: No, that would be--that would be--I think we're wrong on that. We've got the Lundsford (ph), no that's seventy-nine at Clinton. Seventy-nine at Clinton. Eighty is Lundsford. Okay, that would be just right down the road down here.

AB: Right down here.

BM: Okay. Eighty-one is Lane. The Lane cemetery. Eighty-three is the Clinton.

AB: Now is that--

BM: Eight-one, that's the Lane. That's a way the heck off over here. That's way off over here in the southwest, southeast corner of, or that'd be the southwest corner, back off down there.

AB: Is it like them to have two cemeteries?

BM: I don't know.

AB: What--wasn't Charlie's mother--she was buried down here at--

EB: Probably Tuskegee.

AB: They call that Tuskegee not [indecipherable] now.

EB: And [indecipherable] down there around Edna. A big cemetery, now.

BM: Now, eighty-three, now let's see, where's eighty-three at. [refers to map] Now eighty-three, now we'll come back in here, that's the Clinton cemetery, out east of town out here. Eighty-four, then, is the family cemetery. Eighty-five, then, is yours.

EB: Mmm-hmm.

BM: Eighty-six is Knight.

EB: Wally (ph) Knight?

AB: Yeah, Wally (ph) Knight. Now you've got the McNac (ph) cemetery?

BM: McNac?

AB: McNac. M-C-N-A-C.

BM: M-C-N-A-C.

AB: Yeah.

BM: No, I haven't.

AB: See, they got a cemetery right there at where they lived.

BM: Now, where's that at?

AB: Well, (sighs) well you go out to forty-eight out here--

BM: What, forty-eight, north on forty-eight?

AB: Yeah, north on forty-eight but I can't--it's quite a-ways out there, eight or nine miles out there I guess, and then you turn to go back east. But it's like--

BM: East or west?

AB: West.

BM: Okay, then that'd be out there what they call the old Mac (ph) Baker corner.

AB: Uh-huh, I don't know about that.

BM: See, that'd be about eight mile north up there. Like you're going on to the sub station.

AB: Yeah.

BM: And see, before you get to there you've got the Harlinsville Cemetery and 00:43:00there's no other road--

AB: Yeah, that Harlinsville Cemetery, that's the one I was trying to--

BM: Harlinsville.

AB: Yeah! Harlinsville. That's it.

BM: That's it right there. [refers to map]

AB: Yeah, that's the one I was--but anyway, just like I told you, that if you contact that Amos McNac, he can give you the exact directions. Now he lives out right, he lives out to where Bethel lives. He's lived--where Bethel lives, he lives right across the road from Bethel there.

BM: Oh, okay.

AB: Or he's listed in the telephone directory. He can probably give you the exact mileage out there and some information on it, but all I know is it's a cemetery there.

BM: Okay.

AB: A family cemetery.

BM: Alright. Anything else you might think of?

(pause)

AB: That's the only ones I can think of.

BM: Okay. We'll stop this thing.

end of recording