Gerald Henshaw

Interviewer: Georgia Smith (GS)

Interviewee: Gerald Henshaw (GH)

Other Persons: Jim Hurt (JH)

Date of Interview: June 30, 2021

Location: Bristow, Creek County Oklahoma

Transcriber: Abby Thompson

Organization: Bristow Historical Society, Inc.

Original Cassette Tape Location:

Abstract:

Preface: The following oral history testimony is the result of a cassette tape interview and is part of the Bristow Historical Society, Inc.'s collection of oral histories. The interview was transcribed and processed by the Bristow Historical Society, Inc., with financial assistance from the Montfort Jones & Allie Brown Jones Foundation. Rights to the material are held exclusively by the Bristow Historical Society, Inc.

The reader should bear in mind that he or she is reading a verbatim transcript of spoken, rather than written prose. Insofar as possible, this transcript tries to represent the spoken word. Thus, it should be read as a personal memoir and not as either a researched monograph or edited account.

To the extent possible, the spelling of place names, foreign words, and personal names have been verified, either by reference resources or directly by the interviewee. In some cases, a footnote has been added to the transcript in order to provide more information and/or to clarify a statement. Some uncertainties will inevitably remain regarding some words and their spellings. In these scenarios, a (ph) follows a word or name that is spelled phonetically. The notation [indecipherable] is used when the transcriber has not been able to comprehend the word or phrase being spoken. The notation [inaudible] is used where there is more mumbling than words, or when interference on the tape has made transcription impossible.

GS: This is Georgia Smith with the Bristow Historical society in Bristow, Oklahoma. And this interview is part of the Historical Societies ongoing oral history project. Today is June 30th, 2021 and I'm sitting here with Gerald Henshaw and his friend Jim hurt, who I've just interviewed. And he's going to tell me a little bit about his history in Bristow and Jim might chime in if he has any memories as we go along. So Gerald could you give me your full name?

GH: Gerald Guy Henshaw

GS: Okay, and Jim could you give me your full name again?

JH: Jimmy Allen Hurt

GS: Thank you. Okay Gerald what was your name at birth?GH: Gerald Guy Henshaw

GS: And when were you born?

GH: October 11, 1936

GS: Okay, and were you born here in Bristow?

GH: North of Bristow

GS: North of Bristow, in a house?

GH: In a house

GS: Were you delivered by a doctor or midwife?

GH: Doctor. My granddad was the first medical doctor here in Bristow, Oklahoma

JH: I didn't know that

GS: I didn't know that, what was his name?

GH: Franklin, Franklin A. Henshaw

GH: Franklin A. Henshaw, first doctor here in Bristow

GH: Yes, he was the first medical doctor here in Bristow

GS: About what year was that?

GH: Oh goodness that had to have been, oh I don't know, about 30's?

GS: Was that, okay it was, we were a state

GH: Yeah, yes

GS: Yeah, okay. So your grandfather delivered you?

GH: Yes

GS: Oh, that's a cool story

GH: Right

GS: What were your parents' names? We'll start with your mother's maiden name.

GH: My mother's name was Irene Rush, Rush

Thompsons note: Franklin Abile Henshaw (1857 -- 1954) -- Find A Grave MemorialThompsons note: Rosa Irene Rush Henshaw (1899 -- 1942) -- Find A Grave MemorialGS: Okay

GH: And dads name was Franklin S. Henshaw.

GS: Okay

GH: And they, she was out of Kansas. She lived in Kansas, and they got married in Kansas [Indecipherable] questions.

GS: Okay

GH: They were married in Kansas then came here to, I guess start a family, start a life [Indecipherable]

GS: Do you know what brought them to Bristow?

GH: I have no idea.

GS: Okay.

GH: Probably a wagon

(Laughter)

GS: I bet it was! Do you know about approximately the year they were married?

GH: No, I don't

GS: That's okay, that's okay

GH: I've got that information, well I've got that information

JH: Who said they were married

GS: Right, right

GS: How many children did you have?

GH: We had eleven

GS: Did your parents have?

GH: Parents had eleven.

GS: Eleven!

GH: Eleven children

GS: And where did you fall in that rank?

Thompsons note: Franklin S. Henshaw (1889 -- 1959) -- Find A Grave MemorialGH: I was the sixth one, sixth born

GS: Oh my goodness, you were smack dab in the middle.

GH: Just about, I have a lot of older sisters and four younger sisters

GS: Okay, are any of them still living?

GH: Four girls are living

GS: Oh

GH: You had one died in birth, and she's buried out here in Bristow

GS: Okay

GH: Yeah, they're all still here. Well, in fact, there's three of- two of them live here in Bristow. One lives in Midwest city, one lives over in hu- not Hugo, but over east of here.

GS: Okay what are the name of the ones here in Bristow?

GH: Norma Hallman

GS: Okay

GH: You probably know her, and then Bonita Childress

GS: Okay

JH: Oh yeah

GS: What did your father do for a living?GH: He was an oil worker and a farmer

GS: An oil worker and a farmer.

GH: What happened to him was he was in an oil rig and it blew up with him. And it messed his whole leg up, he lost- he didn't lose the leg but he lost a lot of the muscle in the leg.

GS: Yes

GH: And so the only people that got any money out of that was the attorney. And so we, then went and got a farm out north of here and started farming.

GS: Probably wasn't easy farming with one leg.

Thompson note: Naomi Ann Henshaw (1932 -- 1934) -- Find A Grave MemorialGH: No, he- yeah he knew it. He didn't have a, you know, just, it wasn't a- he just didn't have any muscle in the leg.

GS: I see

GH: He could walk, but he couldn't just stay very long at a time, ya know.

GS: Right, yeah. I'm sure all the kids helped with the farm of course too.

GH: Oh yes, yeah. Well my brother, oldest brother, he had a dairy- he brought a dairy out there

GS: Okay

GH: And I remember having to get up in the morning and milk these cows by hand, and before I went to school. And I'd drink hot milk with my cereal before going to school. And then later on we got a little stance thing that you put over the 00:04:00back of cows and had to sit on it, and then it was called a class B farm, which you didn't have to have cement floors; you could have a dirt floor in this kind of a farm.

GS: Okay

GH: So, but then we got out of that business because he couldn't-- he couldn't run it and I couldn't help him after.

GS: Oh

GH: So we got out of that, and we just raised hay and stuff like that after that. And cattle, we had some cattle.

GS: Sure, yeah. What about your mother, what did she do?

GH: She's a homemaker

GS: Sure

GH: As far as I know, she died about 42' maybe.

GS: So how old were you when she passed away?GH: I was probably about, well I was born in 36' so I was probably about six

GS: Aww

GH: Six years old yeah.

GS: That's sad.

GH: My youngest sisters born pretty close to the time she passed away.

GS: Wow

GH: Yeah

GS: She didn't die in child birth

GH: No, it wasn't child birth. I don't know what she died of really, I don't know.

GS: Okay, are you married Gerald?

GH: Yes.

GS: Okay and your spouse's name?

GH: Helen Henshaw

GS: Helen

GH: Parick Henshaw

GS: And is this the same spouse you've had your entire life?

GH: Yeah, she's put up with me all sixty-something years.

GS: Sixty-something years, that's wonderful.

GH: Yeah

GS: How many children do you have?

GH: I have two children, one daughter and a son. Daughter has two children, a son and a daughter, and I have a great grandchild

GS: Wonderful

GH: Yeah

GS: Wonderful, you're blessed

GH: Yes

GS: Okay, tell me about what life was like at home when you were growing up?

GH: At home, let's see, I had my brothers- let's see, two of my brothers was living there and of course we was in fights all the time, they was fightin' me all the time.

GS: Yeah

GH: And then, course the girls- I was the king [indecipherable] of the girls. You know, I keep charge of them and, and so we kinda just- we's kinda really on our own basically cause dad worked nights, and we were kinda. Then well and I'll 00:06:00tell ya about another story about we had lighting [Indecipherable] house we lived in. First all, we had corduroy lights.

GS: Okay

GH: Had [indecipherable] by the corduroy lights and then we got a- when dad come in put gas lights in, we had gas line go across the property

GS: Right

GH: So was able to tap into that

GS: About what year do you think you got gas?

GH: I know it's kinda early on. I would say probably 36', thirty-

GS: Mid thirties

GH: we had probably late thirties maybe.

GS: Late thirties

GH: Yeah

GS: Okay, go ahead.

GH: Because then-- but he would just run the gas line right along the ceiling and around and then drop a light off of that. [Indecipherable] line did you know

(Laughter)

GH: And so, but then after that, he hooked up a generator, and it had a washing machine motor on the-- back in washing days then, we had to wash it by hand. Anyway, took one of them motors and took it out there in the little building and put it on a generator and then we got lights. Of course, you had to go out there and start the generator-- start that motor up to get a lights.

GS: Oh, it was electricity then?

GH: Right, yeah, after that.

JH: Ohhh

GH: Yeah. And then we didn't have running water, we had to shower-- we had a big, like a big building-- not a building, but a big tub type of thing, it wasn't a tub anyway

JH: Tank?

GH: Tank, yeah.

GS: Okay

GH: And, on top of this building you'd go out there and take a shower.

GS: And you had to leave the house to go take a shower?

GH: Yeah to take a shower, had to leave the house to go to use the bathroom.

GS: Okay

GH: Oh yeah, we'd all that stuff

GS: Oh okay, you had an outhouse, yeah.

GH: Yeah, had to- two holer. Had a two holer, we's a [Indecipherable]

GS: Oh I bet

JH: They refer to that as the good ol' days

(Laughter)

GH: Yeah, but anyway. We had a good time, I had a horse, horses to ride. We used the horses to plow the fields and all that kind of things.

GS: Did you have to work most of the time or did you get time to have fun?

GH: I worked all the time. I worked all the time, yeah. Yeah, took-- only time we had fun was when there somebody come out there and get lost and we could make fun of em'

(Laughter)

GS: Now where is it you lived again?

GH: I lived out three miles north of Bristow.

GS: On 48 or 66?

GH: No on 66, right off of 66.

GS: Oh okay

GH: It's about, I don't know what the name of that road is, do you know where that cemetery is out there that-

GS: Yes

GH: You take that road right north of that cemetery and take it around.

GS: Okay

GH: We lived out there

GS: Okay

GH: Yeah

GS: Did you have any toys as a child?

GH: Toys? Oh yeah, yeah, oh yeah- had a horse.

(Laughter)

JH: Stick

GH: Yeah, a stick horse. Oh but, I was one-- one Christmas I wanted a chaps, so I could be a good cowboy

GS: Oh

GH: Dad got me a little chaps and a gun holder and two guns, I still got the guns by the way.

GS: Oh how neat!

JH: Oh cool!

GH: And Rory Rogers (ph) guns, so I was king of the [Indecipherable] whenever I [Indecipherable]

(Laughter)

GS: Now were you older than your sisters?

GH: I was older than four of them

GS: That's what I was thinking

GH: And I had one older sister, yeah.

GS: So that's why you were the king [Indecipherable].

GH: Yeah that's right, yeah I was the only boy there, ya know

JH: (Laughter)

GS: So did the sisters do a lot of the cooking?

GH: Well, I'll tell ya about that. We cooked, no they didn't much cook. We had a black lady one time

GS: Uh-huh

GH: That came and she cooked for us meals. And my younger sister, she says "I'm not gonna eat that, d'you see them black hands go in that"

GS: Aww

JH: (Laughter)

GH: And so she, my dad cooked most all the meals, yeah, when I was in school and all that. [Indecipherable] My brother would pick us up from school and take us back out to the house and he'd have a bowl of soup or stew or something like that fixed for us.

GS: Was he a pretty good cook?

GH: He was a good cook.

GS: Oh okay

JH: Which one?

GH: My dad.

JH: Oh I thought you said your brother.

GH: No, Tommy. He worked at Oklahoma tire and supply.

GS: Okay

GH: For the Griffins

JH: Oh Tommy, I remember Tommy.

GS: Yes

GH: Yeah

GS: Virgil (ph) and Earl?

GH: No, Virgil and- no it's not here. No it's not

GS: That's okay.

GH: Virgil Earl

GS: Earl, okay.

JH: Virgil Earl.

GS: I think Earl was Virgil's wife.

GH: Yes, Earl was his name- Earl Virgil-- in fact that's my doctor in Midwest city, is the nephew of those guys.

GS: Oh! Well that's a small world!

Thompsons note: Tommy Earl Henshaw Sr. (1929 -- 2007) -- Find A Grave MemorialJH: Wow

GH: Anyway

GS: Yeah. Okay so, did you grow most of your own food, or did you come into town to buy it?

GH: Well, some of both. We grew a lot of it, we ate what was on the field.

GS: And did you can?

GH: No we didn't can much, no. When we'd have mom, but of course wasn't around.

GS: Right

GH: But no we didn't can much.

GS: Probably a bit much to try the canning.

GH: Yeah

GS: What about livestock? Did you do your own butchering?

GH: Yes, butchered the hogs in the wintertime. Put em' in a smoke house, keep them so we could keep em' and eat em' along the way.

GS: Right

GH: Yeah.

GS: What kind of clothes did you wear?

GH: Clothes did we wear? We'd wear regular clothes.

GS: Well, what would be regular clothes?

GH: A shirt and pants.

GS: Overalls, blue jeans?

GH: Yeah mostly blue jeans, I didn't wear overalls much. I don't like overalls. Jeans and shirt, or no shirt. Most of the time in the summer time we had no shirt, yeah.

GS: [Indecipherable] Yeah, and the girls probably all wore dresses.

GH: Yes, they all wore dresses, yes.

GS: What did you-- did you ever get to get out of the house to go do something fun like maybe at church or?

GH: Oh yeah, let me-- let me tell you about this story.

GS: Okay

GH: Back in about 1950

GS: Uh-huh

GH: Television came to Bristow

JH: Ohhh

GH: And one of the guys, Mrs-

JH: Anyway

GH: Anyway, her son won a television

GS: Oh how nice

GH: And gave it to her, and she let us come up there on Saturday nights

GS: And watch TV

GH: And watch wrestling

JH: Outside, right? She put it on the front porch or in the house?

GH: No, no she put it in the house. We'd have wood stove-

JH: This wasn't Solomon

GH: No, no.

JH: Okay go ahead.

GH: I can't think of her name now. Anyway, she let us come up there and the girls and boys would all meet up there on Saturday night and watch wresting and watch [Indecipherable] and throw the [Indecipherable] out.

GS: Yes

GH: Yeah, so we had a good time doing that. And then later on we got a TV and [Indecipherable]

(Laughter)

JH: A big TV

GH: Yeah, a small TV, yeah.

GS: Oh goodness, where did you first attend school Gerald?

GH: Where?

GS: Uh-huh

GS: First grade I was in Edison, and then they decided well [Indecipherable] anyone come in a ride the bus had to go over to Washington.

GS: Okay

GH: So we went over to Washington and stayed there, so I guess, what, sixth grade maybe?

GS: Yes

GH: And then came back to the middle school

GS: Okay

GH: Here, and then graduated out of Bristow High School right out here.

GS: Okay

GH: But I went to both schools.

GS: Okay, who was your first grade teacher?GH: Mrs. List (ph)

GS: Mrs. List was your first grade teacher

GH: Yes

GS: I'm wondering if it was the same List that taught me in upper elementary

GH: I don't know, he-- they owned the List motors.

GS: It was

GH: Yeah, and my brother worked for em'

GS: Okay

GH: Yeah, yeah so she was-- I was telling you that story

JH: Wendell List

GS: Wendell List

JH: Yeah, I don't remember her name

GS: Do you remember his old jalopy he used to drive in the parades?

Thompson note: Wendell Oliver List (1903 -- 1986) -- Find A Grave MemorialGH: Oh yes! Yeah, yeah.

JH: She's bringing back memories

(Laughter)

GH: Yeah, yeah

JH: You must be older than you look

GS: Well 82

GH: Well she's listened to a lot of people, she's listening to a lot of people

(Laughter)

GS: I remember that old jalopy in those parades

GH: Yeah, yeah. He brought it every year.

GS: It's a rather memorable car to- Okay any good memories from grade school?

GH: Grade school?

GS: Usually kids don't have a lot of memories from grade school

GH: I didn't have a lot of memory, I know we had a lot of fun like I's telling you a while ago, playing out in recess time.

GS: Yes

GH: That's what I like best, was your recess time, yeah.

GS: Definitely so.

GH: But I don't have a whole lot of memories. That one I was telling you about first grade, I was crying all year all day long.

[Indecipherable]

GH: Can't get rid of it

GS: And you were only like four or five years' old

GH: About five years old, yeah. Five years old.

GS: When you started school

GH: Yeah I started first grade

GS: First grade

GH: Yeah my sister, oldest sister, brought me in and set me down and walked out of the room and that was in- that was bad news.

(Laughter)

GS: Bad thing to do to a little guy

GH: Yeah

GS: Okay well what about junior high, [Indecipherable]

GH: Well junior high, let's see. What'd we do in junior high?

JH: Lots to do with the farming or the, whatever [Indecipherable]

GH: Yeah, FFA, I had a lot of FFA stuff there.

GS: Okay, was that through the school?

GH: Yeah, Mr. Pow (ph) taught us, we had a lot of shows [Indecipherable] One time I had this pig that I was gonna show, I had it in the back of the trailer, 00:15:00I was gonna take it out to the fairgrounds, but the thing got out, so I chased it all over the world out there. But I finally got it back in the trailer and it died.

GS: Aww

GH: And my brother wanted it butchered and I said "We can't butcher that, that's my hog" So we didn't even get the meat from it

GS: OH, what caused it to die?

GH: Oh it just go exhausted running around over all the [Indecipherable] tryna get it back in that trailer, it just- for a pig nothing before me I'm not chasing it

(Laughter)

GS: Alright what about high school?

GH: Oh high school, yeah we had a lot of fun in high school. We did all kinds of dumb stuff in High School

GS: Were you into sports like Jim was?

GH: No, I-- reason I couldn't get into sports cause I'd have to ride the bus home

GS: [Indecipherable]

GH: They did everything after school

GS: Yes

GH: And if I stayed for sports, I'd have to walk home, because I didn't have any transportation

GS: I've heard that story several times too

GH: Yeah, but later in High School I finally got me a car so

JH: But you'd have any- you were in band.

GH: Oh yeah I played, yeah I tried [Indecipherable]

GS: What did you play in band?

GH: I played the clarinet

GS: Clarinet, I played the clarinet too

GH: Is that right?

GS: Yeah, who was your band director?

GH: [Indecipherable] Fusco, Fusco (ph)

GS: He was mine also

GH: Is that right? Yeah

JH: Oh she is older than she looks

(Laughter)

GS: Hey I graduated in 72'

JH: That's a long ways from 50's. [Indecipherable] those old guys hung around forever

GS: Yes they did

GH: Yeah I forgot about that, yeah

JH: No that's another thing [Indecipherable] here, a lot of times, you've got the different classes of this n' that n'other. The athletes are here, ya know

GH: Yeah

JH: And the band people are here, and that n' other. Well he was in band and I was in sports, but we're the best buds since you could ever ask for

GS: That's wonderful

JH: And I don't know exactly why he liked me

GH: Ah, well we hunted a lot, we'd went huntin' and fishin'

GS: Ah, you had that in common

GH: Yeah, we used to go out and get the pecans, ya know, during Christmas time you had to have money.

GS: Yes

GH: If you's gonna buy anything for anybody.

GS: Yes

GH: So we'd go out pickin' pecans up

GS: Uh-huh

GH: Sell them and picked them up on the halved out at the, north of town. And this guy, he let us pick them up on the halves. So we got a little money to buy a gift.

GS: Now what does that mean by pick them up on the halves?

GH: Well, like you'd pick up two of them and he gets one of them.

GS: Okay, I kinda thought that's what it meant

(Laughter)

GS: But just in case

GH: Cause it's his pecans, but you was doin' the labor for him so, yeah. But most of them didn't even do it on, most of them only done it on the thirds.

GS: Oh okay

GH: But he did it with us on the halves, yeah

GS: Good for him

GH: Yeah

GS: So

GH: But we hunted and Jim wasn't- he came out hunting, we hunted together.

GS: Okay, what did you hunt?

GH: Squirrel and rabbit

GS: Okay

GH: Eat them too

GS: Okay

GH: Yeah, people don't even eat squirrel today

GS: No, no

GH: Wouldn't even think about killing one of them lil'

GS: Cute little fluffy things

GH: Yeah running around on top of the house. The rabbit out in this yard, yeah [Indecipherable]

GS: Okay

GH: Wanna talk about global warming

GS: Yes

GH: We had, of course we were very short then too, but we'd have snow, ya know, up to your knee, and it'd be on there for several days, weeks maybe.

GS: True

GH: But today, if you get a little, ya know two-inch snow, it's gone the next day and nobody thinks about it. So it has to be something to do with global warming.

GS: I imagine it does. I imagine it does.

JH: (Laughter) [Indecipherable]

(Laughter)

GS: Are you an environmentalist?

GH: No, not really.

GS: Not, not really.

GH: Not really.

GS: Okay, any other memories from High School?

GH: High school, no, yeah like I was telling you a while ago that going there in the twelfth grade I was [Inaudible]

GS: Okay now you were in band, did you ever go to the tri state music festival?

GH: Yes, yes I did.

GS: Was that a bit highlight in your year?

GH: That was a big highlight but I was never a very good player.

GS: Oh

GH: I remember I kinda just-- mediocre, ya know.

GS: Uh-huh.

GH: But we had a good band though. We had a band [Indecipherable] we went to tri state, where was that up in

GS: Enid

GH: Enid, yeah, you're right.

GS: I went so

(Laughter)

GH: Yeah, yeah we went up there

GS: Yeah. Okay and now I know that Jim went to a church as a child, did you go to church as a child?

GH: My mother I understand was really a stout Christian, and she'd took us to church every day. Dad didn't go, but, but then I was baptized at the first Baptist church here in Bristow.

GS: Okay, do you remember who your pastor was?

GH: Day

GS: Day?

JH: Vernon Day (ph)

GH: Vernon day, yeah. Yeah he was the pastor and I really remember going home and telling dad that I'd got baptized that day, and I'll tell ya a little story about him too, he was [Indecipherable] because I was, I still remember today, of 00:20:00course we always would. But Whenever my mother passed away, we had these do gooders that'd come in from

JH: Oh boy

GH: Come out there and they were gonna- one of them was with the government. And they were gonna take the kids and divide them up

GS: Oh no

GH: Oh yeah. So he took a little gun, a shot gun to run them off. We never seen them since.

GS: Well good, yeah. That's horrible!

GH: Yeah they come out there "Well you can't take care of those kids"

GS: Oh my goodness

GH: So he'd run them off

GS: Well good for him

GH: We'd see them in the fence

GS: Well good, that's a good thing. Were you baptized in the church?

GH: Yes, baptized in [Indecipherable]

GS: I mean in the church physically

GH: In the church, in the church yeah.

GS: Okay, do you have any good memories of church growing up? Well I mean like, special events or anything, plays, choir, whatever.

GH: Well I was- in the high school I was in a play. I was in, what you call, [Indecipherable]

GS: Oh okay!

GH: Yeah and I was the sergeant [Indecipherable] They'd tell my dad to come too

GS: Oh [Indecipherable]

GH: And I'd say "Yeah we can, we can- church" let's see, thinking, of course they had to give [Indecipherable]. Christmas time they'd do that, an orange, an apple, and then [Indecipherable] candles

GS: Yeah. So you were in this play in high school, were you in speech, drama, and debate?

GH: No, I don't exactly how I got into it, they just needed somebody and they had a competition and they picked, I don't remember exactly why I was, cause I wasn't in speech

GS: Can you tell me anything about the entertainment that we had in Bristow?

GH: Entertainment, oh yeah we had three, two- two shows

GS: Okay

GH: [Indecipherable]

GS: Okay

GH: And one drive in theater out at the--

GS: Pirate drive in

GH: Pirate drive in, take my little 39' ford and fold out seat. The back of it was welded, the trunk was welded shut, it had this seat to get into-- you had to raise the seat to get in the back of-- you had to pile in the back of there, and 00:22:00close the seat down. Drive to the window

JH: Pay for one

(Laughter)

GH: Pay for one person

JH: He's to confessing now

GS: I see that, I see that. Well now that I think about once a week, didn't they have a- you know, everybody could stuff into the car for so much?

JH: That was after our time

GS: What about on the fourth of July, did they have the special event there?

GH: We had-- well we did. We went out at the park

GS: Okay

GH: Most-- a lot of families. And we went out to the car; we had tubs of ice [Indecipherable] That's the only day of the year you ever got all 71 to drink. You didn't care, you'd just go get you one, open it, drink it, this was on the 4th of July. Then that evening, they would have the fireworks.

GS: Okay

GH: Yeah we always had a good time at the [Indecipherable]

GS: Well sure

GH: Fun things they'd play

GS: Yeah

GH: There were several things get from the country [Inaudible]

GS: Were there any other events like that that Bristow did back then that you can remember?

JH: I can add one

GH: Okay

JH: Right now, what you're thinking about the amphitheater, which I been to in the last two or three years. They still have a little bit of stuff out, but when I was young we was there and I can remember a gal in a wheelchair that one evening they were having a musical or whatever thing she sang "I'll Never Walk Alone" You'll never walk alone

GS: Aww

JH: So I've always-- that song's always meant so much to me and all, but she had had polio I guess is what is was those days

GS: Yeah

JH: I'm glad that they're using the amphitheater again a little bit

GS: Yes, we are too

JH: Yeah

GS: It's a good asset for the city of Bristow

JH: And then we used to cross the street from that on the south side had the barns where we'd had the county fair-- not the county fair

GH: No, the city fair

GS: Oh no county fair was there

JH: I thought it was

GS: It was, we had the creek country fair there until they moved it to Sapulpa

JH: Yeah

GH: They used to have rodeos there when I was in school

GS: Yes, yes they did

GH: And parades, lots and lots of parades all the time

JH: And they used to have carnivals out in that area, and one thing about [Indecipherable] maybe it was Porsche, Gerald I don't know how we're gonna decide who's the [Indecipherable] and all, but I went there--

GH: [Indecipherable]

(Laughter)

JH: I was in about the third or fourth grade I went with Peggy Durham and her older, little bit older, friend and the three of us went to the fair and we was wanting to ride a ride. Well, all I had was a nickel or dime and so they pitched said "Well let's just pitch our money all together and we can ride" So they pitched the money together and the three of us got to ride the Ferris wheel or something and so, you know (Laughter)

GH: [Indecipherable] I never claimed to be poor because I didn't know I was poor

GS: Exactly, you know I thought--

JH: It's the way it is

GH: It's the way it was

GS: I think most people back then didn't consider themselves poor, ya know. They had enough to eat, they had clothes on their back, and they were happy.

GH: Absolutely, back then [Indecipherable]

GS: Yup, yup. Can't ask for much more than that. Did you ever have to go to the doctor when you were a kid?

GH: Yeah I had to go- went to Doctor King of course

GS: Yes

GH: Talked about that a while ago

GS: Uh-huh

GH: About [Inaudible]

GS: Okay

GH: And they'd come to the school some and they'd- I know

GS: Okay

GH: I remember Crest- Crest toothpaste would give you a crest toothpaste and a toothbrush, and-

GS: I'd forgotten that

GH: And they gave that to us and, you know, take care of your teeth. And when I was in the service, first day I was in the service at boot camp, the guy says "How do you brush your teeth?" and of course I didn't have any ideas. He said "Well the way you brush them is to brush them up and down"

GS: Uh-huh

GH: And so I brushed my teeth up and down ever since then

GS: Sure

GH: Then I went to dental school over here in Oklahoma City, and this doctor came in and said "How do you brush your teeth?" and I said "I brush them up and down" and he said "Well how come you do that?" and I said "Well that's what I learned in the service, how to brush my teeth". So he put it in his books, and you get his books now they have how to brush your teeth and brush them up and down.

GS: I've heard that it should be up and down and not back and forth

GH: Yeah, and the reason for- you know what the reason for that is?

GS: No

GH: Because you get your gums

GS: I see

GH: Gums down and massages your gum

GS: Okay

GH: And that's what keeps your teeth in

GS: Okay

JH: Hmm

GH: I've got all my teeth

JH: Hmm

GH: What

JH: I just said 'Hmm'

(Laughter)

JH: Just thinking here, no yeah, Hmm

GH: Well [Indecipherable]

GS: Can you tell me anything else about entertainment in Bristow when you were growing up?

GH: Let's see

GS: I know you didn't get to come in often from the farm

GH: No, swim. We used to come in and swim on special, I think it's Saturdays maybe, I don't know.

GS: Was that at the silver plunge?JH: Silver plunge

GH: Yeah, yeah

GS: Okay

GH: When we swam, of course we swam around ponds and [Inaudible]

GS: And now

GH: Swam in a lot of ponds and lakes

GS: Yes, uh-huh. Yesterday in an interview I did, the man was telling me that 00:27:00there was a, of course the skating rink

GH: Oh yeah, I forgot about that

JH: Mhm

GS: And that in the wintertime for a few years they had bowling on that skating rink floor. Do you-- either one of you remember that?

JH: No

GH: Barely, skating rink barely

GS: Did you ever go skating in the rink?JH: Oh yeah, yeah yeah

GS: Were you pretty good?

JH: Well, I learned.

GH: After many falls [Inaudible]

GS: Yeah

JH: Better now to stay up

GS: Did you ever climb that long stairway up to the bathroom with your skates on?

(Laughter)

GH: Oh, I guess so, guess so. I forgot about that skating rink

JH: I did too, it's been on Facebook things here recently.

GS: Did you ever go as a group, or did you just go individually?

GH: We would go individually, I'd just [Inaudible]

GS: Yeah. What about you, did you ever go Jim?

JH: A few time, but I wasn't a good skater at all

GS: Aw okay

GH: [Inaudible] Also it we used to skate the ponds, [Indecipherable] the ponds would freeze over

GS: Yes

GH: [Indecipherable] ice

GS: Thick ice

GH: And you could get on then and so my dad bought me a pair of ice skates

GS: Yes

JH: Hmm

GH: And so I get that [Inaudible] of course I [Indecipherable] back then

(Laughter)

GS: As a child, what did you want to be when you grew up?

GH: Old

GS: Amen

GH: Now I'm old. [Indecipherable] I guess I wanted to be a cowboy

GS: A cowboy?

GH: [Inaudible] I always wanted to be [Inaudible] and stuff

GS: Right

GH: Silver [Inaudible]

GS: Very romanticized image of the cowboy

GH: Right

GS: What was your first job other than farm?

GH: Other than farm?

GS: Yeah

GH: Probably mechanic

GS: Okay

GH: My brother had a mechanic shop

GS: Okay

GH: There at the high school, in fact

GS: Oh

GH: And right there in the high school. And I worked for him at nights after school

GS: Okay

GH: He said "you're doing a great job" and [Inaudible]

JH: I'll share a little bit of something here about we didn't get into my first job and all. I was- first of all selling papers said ten and eleven, selling papers on the street

GS: Okay

JH: And back to the California people; they come through, we had parking meters that you put your nickel, dime, or throw a pen there and pens turn the crank and it'd go down. But somebody taught us that if you chew gum and stick it up in there, then they would stick it up in there and crank and [Indecipherable] go on in J&J Café (ph) or in the Hamburger Shop and we could come along with a pocket knife and flip out the [Indecipherable]. But also I sold papers as I said on the street and I'd go in the pool hall and I'd go up to guys playing their dominos 00:30:00and everything, said "Well paper paper! Paper paper!" and no and one said "I can't read" another woger (ph) said "C'mere" when they tell you that, you tell them "Well can you smell?" "Well yeah it's all BS anyway"

(Laughter)

JH: So yeah you're bringing back- we're having memory time here

GH: I will tell ya about the Oklahoma Times Supply (ph)

GS: Oh yes

GH: Well I guess one of the last ones, first job. It's Christmas time they had flowers.

GS: Uh-huh

GH: And I delivered the flowers all over, part of it not all the city, but it was part of the city

GS: Sure

GH: The guy who worked with me, he'd throw his in the trash, in the trash

JH: Nooo

GH: And he wouldn't deliver his

GS: Well shame on him!

GH: Yeah I know!

GS: He wasn't doing an honest day's work for his job, was he?

GH: No

GS: He was not

GH: Well he'd make fun of me

JH: Told ya that sin and nature started a long time ago

GS: Did you- do you have anything else on your paper there about any of the business or entertainment in Bristow that you?

GH: Well yeah I tell you today about this John Sukabody (ph) guy, I don't know

GS: I've heard of the Sukabodys, but I don't know much

JH: Ohhh, feed store

GH: He had a feed store

GS: Yes

JH: Yeah

GS: Sukabody feed store

GH: There on main street. Well he-- he hired little boys during the summer, worked at JR Childress (ph) [Inaudible]

GS: Okay

GH: And we got to be pretty good-- he was a really nice guy; course he drank a lot [Inaudible]. But he was really a nice guy. So anyway when I got out of service, I was in there talking to him one day and I [indecipherable] any idea of what I was gonna do. But I knew it was gonna be brutal cause I went in to get the GI bill for school

GS: Right

GH: So he-- I said "I don't know" I said "I'm thinking about going into plumbing" He said "Oh no" he said "You don't wanna go into plumbing" he said "That's a cold job, dirty job. What you need to get into is electronics" says 00:32:00"You've got air conditioning, you've got everything you need right there" So that sounded pretty good to me, so that's what I did. I went in, went to school for [Indecipherable] electronics at OSU in Okmulgee

GS: At Okmulgee, uh-huh, yeah

JH: I [Indecipherable] forgot about that [Inaudible]

GS: So did you do the two-year thing?

GH: Oh yeah I did the two-years, got a job with the government, stayed in

JH: Quite a successful [Indecipherable] I might add

GH: Yeah, I thought life was pretty good with electronics, but I can't even turn the radio on now. Can't even-- can't even operate my phone

JH: Yeah I know

GH: And I-- I was pretty sharp with electronics

GS: It's a different world now

GH: Well you keep up with it

GS: Yeah

GH: [Indecipherable] Anyway that's [Inaudible]

GS: So is that how you made your living for years as an electrician?

GH: Not electrician, electronics.

GS: Electronics

GH: Yes

GS: Okay

GH: Yeah I was in it for [indecipherable] Went to work for the government after I got out of OSU

GS: Okay

GH: [Inaudible]

GS: Yeah OSU

GH: yeah

GS: Tech, school of technical training, yes

GH: I got myself a social degree

GS: Okay, yeah

GH: So that's what I got [Indecipherable] He said "What do you got?" I said "I've got two years' college" he said "No you've got a social degree"

GS: There ya go

GH: So [Indecipherable] social degree, one step up

GS: There ya go

GH: Anyway, I went to work for them then I went to work for-- Well I might tell you this story. Contract Administration, we would go out-- too much time?

GS: No I just like to make sure it's still running because I've had the battery go dead on me before

GH: Oh, anyway, [Indecipherable] and went to work as a contract administrator. We were the ones who bought product for the government. Ya know, five-thousand-dollar hammer

GS: Uh-huh

GH: And get your groceries for fifty cents. Anyway, we bought those kinds of products. Well one of the products was [Inaudible] went to the moon. And what they did was they took some metal out to the moon with them and come back and made these little medallions saying "Moon Shop"

GS: Oh yes

GH: And the contractor that I was working with made the clothes, made the suits

GS: Oh how wonderful

GH: And so I was the guy that bought those suits, so anyway I got one of those 00:34:00with me [Indecipherable]

GS: Oh that's a wonderful keepsake

GH: Yeah, I still- I can't tell you where it is right now but I know I've still

GS: But you've got it

JH: You've got it

(Laughter)

GS: You're sure of that

GH: Anyway, that's among some of the other things. But I had a lot of experience in that field

GS: Sure

GH: Ya know, all the products that they bought I bought them from American Lines to--

GS: So who did you work for at that time?

GH: Worked for the federal government

GS: For the federal government, okay

GH: Contract Administration

GS: Okay

GH: DLA (ph)

GS: Okay, very good. Okay so any other businesses or anything else you've got written on that paper you wanna tell me about?

JH: While he's lookin' I'll tell you about my first job other than selling newspaper and delivering newspapers over the street. I was carrying five gallons 00:35:00of ice cream from the Locker Plant down to the Palace Drug where I worked for a short period of time.

GS: Okay

JH: With one of his aunts

GS: Oh

JH: Anyway, yeah Palace Drug

GS: And you had to make sure that ice cream didn't melt, didn't ya

JH: Yeah ya had to walk fast

GH: What was that other one right there on North end of town? That little ol'-

JH: The other what?

GH: Café. Was it Ki-way (ph)

GS: Ki-way Café?

JH: Oh Hi-Café was good, yeah

GH: is that the one on the north?

GS: It was on the north

JH: It was by the Locker Plant

GS: North of ninth and main

GH: Yeah

JH: Yeah

GH: Yeah

GS: Yeah, that was a good place to eat

GH: Yeah that was- I don't remember that

GS: Did you eat there often?

GH: Oh I didn't have nothing to eat

GS: Yeah

GH: I was in there a lot, but I didn't-- cause somebody else was in there but

GS: Yeah

GH: But no I didn't eat there very much.

GS: yeah

GH: I'll tell ya about my first loan

GS: Okay

GH: At Bristow Community Bank

GS: Okay

GH: I went in there to get a loan, I wanted to buy a car. Well, they-- one of the banks wouldn't loan it to me and I went to the other bank anyway. And I had [Indecipherable] for collateral, had to put my vehicle up for collateral. Then I went to buy insurance, and I went down to this friend of ours, so called, and State Farm. I said "I need to get some insurance" said "I'm not selling you any insurance" he says "You's like a pig in a puddle" I'm like 'Okay' so

GS: Well

GH: Yeah I don't know why he [Indecipherable], called me a catfish and called me all kinds of stuff

GS: Well he didn't want business very badly, did he?

GH: [Indecipherable] I guess

GS: I guess not

GH: I kept thinking, his wife was [Indecipherable] she's the one who took care of the girls and all kinds of things. Anyway, went in finally and when I went over to Allstate, and bought-- they sold me insurance for the car and then [Inaudible]

GS: Well good

GH: People are people

GS: Yes, yup, yeah you never can predict them a lot of times. So what branch of 00:37:00the service were you in?

GH: I was in the air force

GS: In the air force? And what was your-- what were your duties there?

GH: My duties in the air force I'll tell ya that story. I went in and [Indecipherable] and I were friend, we lived out in [Indecipherable] county. Anyway, we went in, the recruiter says "Okay you boys can stay together. While you were in the service, we decided that you boys are really good". Well we went- we worked together one night in base; we went into basic training, got through with that. 8th Air force police force, 8th Air force police. We got wiped out in ol' Korea. So this whole platoon went into the air police except one. It was [Indecipherable]. Him and ol' [Indecipherable].

GS: Wouldn't you know

GH: Yeah, yeah I was in the air police, then from there I went to the canine school, and I had a canine, [Inaudible]. Reason I had a canine is cause I didn't wanna go overseas.

GS: Yeah, yeah I don't blame ya there

GH: I was like "Ehh"

GS: Now this was in the late fifties, so Vietnam might have been looming on the horizon, wasn't it?

GH: Right at the end, right at the end. In 58' maybe

GS: Well Vietnam ended in the early seventies

GH: Not Vietnam, Korea

GS: Korea

GH: Maybe I said Vietnam

GS: Yeah I said Vietnam, you were thinking Korea

GH: Korea, yeah Korea

GS: Yeah at the end of the Korean war so you might have had to have gone to Korea if you hadn't done the canine thing.

GH: Yeah

GS: Well that was a smart move

GH: Yeah that's what I thought too

GS: Yeah

JH: But the dang dog like to eat [Inaudible]

GS: Wasn't your best friend?

GH: No that dog I had he was mean as could be. When I'd go on vacation, they had to put a chain on his food bowl, they wouldn't even go in there and feed him.

GS: Oh my goodness

GH: And they put a chain on his bowl to pull it out, put food in it, put it back in there.

GS: You never couldn't nicen him up?GH: No he would bite ya, he would- I'd give him a command he would growl at me.

GS: Aww

GH: Then I had to keep a muzzle on him anytime we was around any other dogs.

GS: Aw, that's a shame

GH: But he was a good-

GS: So what were they trained for?

GH: They were trained for patrol

GS: Okay, and did you take yours out on patrol?

GH: Oh yeah, yeah every night

GS: Did he make believers out of people?

GH: Yeah, oh yes.

(Laughter)

GH: Yeah, the way they trained him of course, ya know, [Indecipherable] he'd be hiding out there in the woods somewhere in the grass, and the dog had to sniff him out.

JH: Ohh

JH: Attack them [Indecipherable] But anyway the reason I got out of service, I was thinking about staying in for four years, but they let me on post. They didn't pick me up come daylight, they had to come pick the dogs up at daylight

GS: Oh

GH: So they never come pick me up, so about 8 O'clock I kept hollering and 00:40:00blowing the whistle. So finally I just walked up there to the shop, said I'd take me-- I was up in Clinton, Oklahoma at that time. It was at base at Altus and Altus was doing [Indecipherable] and they were sending us up to Clinton. So I walked in there and said "I'm good now [Indecipherable] Check me out". So they sent me back down to the Altus [Indecipherable]. So that's how I got out.

GS: Aw, I guess it was you had been in there long enough to- you could do that too

GH: I guess I'd learned then that- I learned then didn't I?

GS: I guess you did! Teach them to leave you on post!

GH: Yeah they could be [Indecipherable]

JH: You never do [Indecipherable]

GH: But they had to put the dogs up anyway.

GS: Yup, Did I miss something Jim?

JH: Yeah, the bootleggers

GS: Oh the bootleggers! We mentioned them but we didn't go any further! Tell me about the bootleggers, one of ya.

GH: Well the bootleggers-

GS: Well you talked about buying the white lightening and then feeling guilty 00:41:00about spending the buck on it

GH: Yeah, well it wasn't my dollar, it was my dad's dollar.

GS: Yeah

JH: No Frank Junie (ph) lived down the road from me, and everybody knew he was a bootlegger, and his daughter married a bootlegger whose name was Smith who lived across from J&J Café upstairs. But anyway, Frank had a boat with a cover over it and he'd go to Missouri and pick it up and come back so-- otherwise you drove one of these big cars and loaded it down the back end the highway patrol would stop you and then take all your merchandise

GS: So are you saying he kept his white lightening in the boat?

JH: No it wasn't white lightening, it's just liquor

GS: Oh, that was bought

JH: That's right, yeah. And then the Texco (ph) Café somebody told me to-- was it you or somebody else that [Indecipherable] No, Jonny Baker, whoever run the Texco (ph) Café that's where people stopped driving through from Chicago to California and need some liquor and they need to call over and Frank would bring 00:42:00it over to them and all

GS: Okay

JH: Yeah, but we-

GS: And was that during prohibition or?

JH: Oh yeah, it's yeah.

GS: Yup

GH: I forgot to tell you about wheat harvest

GS: Tell me about that wheat harvest

GH: Wheat harvest, yeah we went to wheat harvest up in Kansas

GS: Yes

GH: And I drove the truck up there

GS: Uh-huh

GH: To wheat harvest. [Indecipherable] International truck

GS: Yes

GH: Stick, shift gears

GS: Uh-huh

GH: Come up [Indecipherable] had to hold it down and shift the gears. Anyway, of course he couldn't afford to get a [Indecipherable], take the time out to get it fixed, he had to do it this weekend. Anyway, so when we got wheat done, we had bailed stubble, and then you cut the wheat about [Indecipherable]

GS: Uh-huh

GH: And then we had all this stubble. And he was bailing it, and the way they bailed it was they bailed it then run it off on another run. [Indecipherable] half the thing, and then they'd this pole, put it down in the ground, and hold it against them- push the bails off the skid.

GS: Okay

GH: Well I wasn't big enough or strong enough, so when they put me on that one 00:43:00the thing tumbled on top of me

GS: Oh no!

GH: Rod came down, so the guy says "You need to go home" [Indecipherable] the wheat harvest then come home

(Laughter)

GS: Oh my goodness, Well, I know that wasn't easy work and I do know a lot of young men did the wheat harvest too

GH: Oh yeah

JH: It's pretty good money [Indecipherable]

GH: [Indecipherable]

GS: Yup, can't beat that. Anything else that you can think of that we haven't hit on Gerald?

GH: No, but I was gonna tell you about the money though back when I went into service, I had a little money in the bank and I didn't figure I'd ever come back to the service [Inaudible]. Anyway I gave all the money I had to my dad to put water into the house, when we lived down on the farm

GS: aww, yes

GH: And then I went on in the service, [Indecipherable] I came back.

GS: Yeah. So you graduated in 54' and is that when you went into the service?

GH: Yes, yeah

GS: Okay, and you got the GI bill, you got your education paid for, and you went to Okmulgee.

GH: I wouldn't say it was paid for, I starved to death there too. My wife worked, we went to Okmulgee

GS: Uh-huh

GH: My wife worked in the library, and [Indecipherable] I worked for fifty cents an hour

GS: Yes

GH: Up there at the [Indecipherable]. Oh I'll tell you about that story. One night we put the money, after you work and [Indecipherable] and you put it in wall. Well, you'd put it in a sack and drop it down the wall [Indecipherable]. Well one day, we came around and money wasn't there. But I wasn't working, the other guy was working.

JH: [Indecipherable]

GH: Yeah absolutely, but I had to pay for it anyway. But anyway, he accused us 00:45:00of stealing the money. I said "I didn't steal, I don't even have it, I don't know what you're talking about" so anyway we got with the cops and they put us in [Indecipherable], in a bag and put it behind this wall. Come to find out, this kid was watching and he'd climb through one of the windows right there and went over there and got the washers and they called. Well, he wanted us to pay and started making us pay a dollar a paycheck to pay that money back that he'd lost in that [Indecipherable] and I said-

GS: And you didn't even take it!

GH: Did not! He just [Indecipherable] so that's when I quit.

GS: Well yes I would too. That just wasn't right at all! I'm gonna ask you the same question I asked Jim. As you see it now, what are some of the biggest problems that face our nation and how do you think they could be solved?

GH: Biggest problem that I can [Indecipherable] is selfishness

GS: Yeah

GH: People who haven't had to work, are not working, they think the big government is gonna take care of them for the rest of their lives. Talking about 00:46:00giving them free college, and free this free that, which I think is wrong and way to turn that around is to give a persona a hand up instead of a hand out.

GS: Give them an incentive

GH: Give them something [Indecipherable] teach them out to fish and all that stuff

GS: Exactly

GH: And I think that's what's gonna have to take place, now whether it's gonna take place or not, it's very doubtful that the way that we're running the government now that we're doing anything right. People from these other countries come in; Cartels are just eating us up down here, kids up, people up, costing us millions of dollars. And somebodies having to pay for all that. Anyway, I think the problem is that the government is getting too big to control 00:47:00for its own good.

GS: Yeah, I have to agree with you there

GH: And I think the only way you can change it is probably through elections.

GS: Yup

GH: If you can find [Indecipherable]

GS: Amen, amen. Anything else you wanna tell me that I haven't hit on or that you've got in your notes there that we didn't hit on?

GH: I think we covered just about everything, that's what I think.

JH: Well you've got a lot of stories now, don't you?

GS: Yes, we do. We have a lot of stories and it's so fun doing this. It's really nice to--

JH: And someday will I be able to get onto the internet and see something?

GS: Yes, I can't tell you when it'll be. But there are some on there already, BristowHistoricalSociety.org, BristowHistoricalSociety.org. You can go on there and listen to some of them that are on there. We've got Mr Krumme

JH: So, .BristowHistoricalSociety.org

GS: .org

JH: Okay

GH: Of course [Indecipherable] Hamburger King, I don't know if we ever talked about that.

GS: We didn't talk about Hamburger King, what are your memories of the Hamburger King?

GH: Memories of the Hamburger King is that we met down there about every night

GS: Uh-huh

GH: Kids would meet there and have dates and all this kind of stuff. Then we'd come down there and reminisce once in a while. Of course I didn't have a car at that time, I'd have to either catch a ride or walk home.

GS: Right

GH: And sometimes I could catch a ride and sometime I didn't, so I'd have to walk home. But we'd- that's a gathering spot for people [Indecipherable].

GS: Okay was it mostly for the younger generation?

GH: Oh yeah, just for the high schoolers.

GS: Yeah, well did they have music or anything like that?

GH: I don't remember having music in there, did we?

JH: Only when Jonny Lee Wills or one of the big bands came through that's always where they either stopped there or out at Lucian Tigers place where Luke Fry now lives out between Slick and Kellyville, they also had big parties out there. But yeah, the big country bands, Jonny Lee Wills, Bob Wills, and all of them, they would stop at Hamburger King

GS: Yeah

JH: Then the J&J Café was always fancy for the more wealthy people and all the society--

GS: To eat at

JH: --that went to the J&J Café. But the black people I don't remember if we mentioned or what but they had to park around at the back and knock on the door and the guy would come out and take their order and go back in and fix it and then bring it out and they had to eat in their car. But you know that's why this route 66 in [Indecipherable] Chicago and went to where in California?

GS: I don't remember

JH: Santa Maria, it wasn't where people from Los Angelas, Santa--

GH: Santa?

JH: No, Santa something or other, but anyway yeah there's lots of memories from Hamburger King

GS: Okay, alright well

GH: Yeah we used to when Jim was talking about parking a wagon behind those stores, we did that, that's how I came to get to go to town, by wagon. We either 00:50:00came there by horse, or walk, or wagon.

GS: uh-huh

GH: And sometimes you could catch a ride on the wagon, the wagon would come by and you'd run out there and get on the back of it and hitch you a ride to town

GS: Well sure!

GH: So you didn't have to walk. So anyway, they parked it, you tied em up behind those stores and there had to be somebody down there with them all of the time because people would come in and steal stuff out of the wagon.

GS: So were there more wagons or more automobiles?

JH: [Indecipherable] more wagonsGS: More wagons at that time

JH: Yeah more wagons, I don't know [Inaudible]

GH: There was also a little restaurant and a little hotel type thing down there, Donald Crawford, boy you're really pulling up now, but it was there right across the ally and then there behind that behind Thorpe's and the fay and [Indecipherable] was where all the wagons parked in there and left them, ya know, they just tied them up and walked-- take care of their business

GS: What Block would that be Jim?

JH: You know where the big café at sixth, right?

GS: Uh-huh

JH: Okay

GS: Golden Eagle Café?

JH: Yeah, right just east there to the back ally and then there and then run- yeah

GS: Okay yeah I see, that's really interesting. Well thank you both very much for coming today. I appreciate it so much Gerald. I've not had a chance to tell any of my neighbors that I said you're related to that- or you told me you're related to, I haven't got a chance to tell them I've spoken with you so thank you very much, I really appreciate it.