Mary Jane Trigalet

Interviewer: Joe Trigalet

Interviewee: Mary Jane Trigalet

Other Persons:

Date of Interview: June 6, 2021

Location: Bristow, Creek County Oklahoma

Transcriber: Abby Thompson

Organization: Bristow Historical Society, Inc.

Original Cassette Tape Location: OHP-2021-21 00:00 -- 78:26

Abstract:

Preface: The following oral history testimony is the result of a cassette tape interview and is part of the Bristow Historical Society, Inc.'s collection of oral histories. The interview was transcribed and processed by the Bristow Historical Society, Inc., with financial assistance from the Montfort Jones & Allie Brown Jones Foundation. Rights to the material are held exclusively by the Bristow Historical Society, Inc.

The reader should bear in mind that he or she is reading a verbatim transcript of spoken, rather than written prose. Insofar as possible, this transcript tries to represent the spoken word. Thus, it should be read as a personal memoir and not as either a researched monograph or edited account.

To the extent possible, the spelling of place names, foreign words, and personal names have been verified, either by reference resources or directly by the interviewee. In some cases, a footnote has been added to the transcript in order to provide more information and/or to clarify a statement. Some uncertainties will inevitably remain regarding some words and their spellings. In these scenarios, a (ph) follows a word or name that is spelled phonetically. The notation [indecipherable] is used when the transcriber has not been able to comprehend the word or phrase being spoken. The notation [inaudible] is used where there is more mumbling than words, or when interference on the tape has made transcription impossible.

MT: Now is it recording?

JT: Yeah

MT: Check

JT: This is Joe Trigalet with the Bristow Historical Society in Bristow, Oklahoma, and this interview is part of the Historical Societies ongoing oral history project. The date is June 6, 2021 and I'm sitting here with Mary Jane Trigalet who is going to tell me a little bit about her history in the Bristow area, and the workings of the garment factory. So a few questions about you first, what was your name at birth?

MT: Mary Jane Trigalet

JT: And where were you born?

MT: In Okmulgee, Oklahoma on August the 26th, 1942.

JT: 1942, was that in home or hospital

MT: In a hospital

JT: And your parents' names?

MT: Was Jean Francois Trigalet (ph) and Margaret Ann Jidasco Trigalet (ph)

JT: And when were they married?

MT: They were married on May the 27th, 1939

JT: 1922, wasn't it?

MT: 1939 is when they got married

JT: Oh when they got married, yes that's right, okay.

MT: You wanna say it all over again?

JT: Okay, where did they meet and why did they come to Oklahoma?

MT: My father was in Pennsylvania for the war effort cutting glass, that was his trade, he was an apprentice to my grandfather who was also a glass cutter. And they were in Pennsylvania and he actually met my mother at a skating rink. And I guess they were dating for about a year, close to a year and then she graduated from high school and they got married.

JT: And why did they come to Oklahoma?

MT: They came to Oklahoma to begin with because my father, being a glass cutter, came to work at the Okmulgee and Henrietta plants doing the same thing, cutting glass. And he wanted to come back to Oklahoma and still be in there in Pennsylvania. So anyway they came back with their first child, which was Steven, and they moved to Okmulgee where he had the job. And he worked there for several years and then he had an opportunity to come to Bristow and buy what was a bus station from Mr. Fullerton (ph). And so he took the opportunity, and so then we ended up in Bristow and at that time I was about three.

JT: And then, I forgot. Okay well thank you. Okay, now then, we were here--and this was my idea basically because I know that you worked a long time out at the garment factory

MT: 19 Years

JT: 19 years at the garment factory. Now first of all, did you work there until they closed down?

MT: M-m

JT: Oh okay

MT: No, no they were going to come along--excuse me, they were coming along and cutting everybody's wages, cutting their piecework's. And they got to me after 19 years and were cutting mine back and they told me what my new rates were gonna be and already a lot of people had left the garment factory to go to work at the carpet plant. And so then I didn't want to go work the carpet plant and I happened to drive by that Saturday morning and they were building the community bank drive in down by the railroad tracks and I thought "I know I can do anything they do". So the next Monday, I left work early and went home, changed to look presentable, and walked into community bank and asked for an application. And the person I asked for the application was Billy Faha (ph), and he said "You wait right there and I'll get that application for you".

JT: So

MT: So then I went to work there about three months later

JT: Okay, and so when was that, when that happened?

MT: 1983

JT: So that was 1983, how much longer was the garment factory open? Do you remember?

MT: Oh, a few more years, I don't really know exactly. But it had a lot of, not as much staff or anything, and then I believe the manager kind of took it over in some other kind of capacity instead of actually that company that--

JT: Who was that company?

MT: I believe it got changed and all and I'm not even sure what it was. I've heard way back, but I remember it being as Gossard Artemis (ph)

JT: Gossard Artemis (ph)

MT: Artemis, and then it became Miss Elaine, so maybe it was still Gossard 00:05:00Artemis but the products we made were under the Miss Elaine label

JT: Label, okay. Okay, we'll get back to some other of that, but--so you were talking earlier about when they were starting to cut things and you were talking about the items and your rate, so can you tell me how that was structured?

MT: Yes, all the way from what we call the back of the building to the front, everything was set up and everything processed through there. Started out on the huge, huge tables with stacks and stacks of fabric. And then there was a tall electric type knife thing that would cut through these, I don't even know how 00:06:00many layers of fabric, it would be, oh a foot and a half tall or so.

JT: Of fabric?

MT: Of fabric

JT: Just laying flat?

MT: Laid flat, and I'm not--maybe it wasn't, maybe it was a foot. But it was tall.

JT: Mhm

MT: And this knife, they had the pattern on there and they just went around and moved that around and cut off, cut what they needed just like any other pattern

JT: And you--so the pattern cut through every layer of cloth

MT: Yes, the knife. And one girl actually cut her finger, maybe two fingers off. And went to the hospital and they put it back on, and she had a crooked finger but she came back to work later and anyway.

JT: So, so they had these stacked. I mean this is layers of fabric

MT: Yes, yes.

JT: And this, wow

MT: And I never worked back in that part. But then they took that and they had to take each piece and they would take so many of each piece that went together to make the garment and it'd be wrapped up in a bundle.

JT: Mhm

MT: Everything that was needed. And then it started the back, it started certain processes and went from one group of sewers did one thing and then it moved up and went to the next one, and they'd do their thing, bundle it back up and throw it in the bin in front of them. And then the next people would get them and do their thing and it just kept coming up until it got to the front

JT: Yeah, so the--if they threw it in the bin in front of them, then the next person would just turn around and pick one up out of the bin and then turn back around and sew it

MT: Yeah and some of those got kind of heavy because a lot of times there was like a dozen garments in one, maybe even more than that some of the time. And they got, they were kind of heavy. But yeah they'd pick up the bundle and then they'd take it and lay it at their machine and start doing their thing.

JT: Wow

MT: And I mean it went from having, you know, the seams were made and sleeves were put in and, you know, all the little details and made some beautiful 00:08:00beautiful things and then it'd move on up until it maybe get lace added around it or somewhere the lace, they used a lot of lace on things, and then they'd get up and it'd be hemmed and then it would get on up there and if it something that needed button and button holes, that was mine, I did the button holes basically, I didn't do that many buttons. But I can do anywhere from between 6-8 thousand button holes in a day just going through there. But I was good at it. But anyway, so then after it left me, it went to the inspectors, every garment was inspected. And if something came up looking wrong or something, it was taken back by runners to wherever it needed to go to get fixed. And you know, maybe 00:09:00there'd be a flaw in the material that was discovered for some reason, and if it had gone, you know, it was too hard to do, that just went into the seconds. But yeah everything was inspected. And then it went to, they used to do folding, they folded everything and they went to little flat boxes. Other people probably remember, the little flat boxes, little lingerie boxes and all that were just skinny, and so everything had to be folded and put in there wrapped in tissue and so it was all in boxes. And then they went to hanging them and they didn't do the boxes anymore.

JT: Well, so I want to go back to, because I have some questions about this whole process, but I know that in--now these were, I understand these were pretty high class garments that were being made

MT: Oh yes, yeah these were in the finest stores

JT: In the finest stores, well it seems like to me that in these fine stores, that the pattern on a blouse where the sleeve would meet the shirt or blouse

MT: Yeah, yeah

JT: That it matches, it would match. Did, maybe that was a later thing where people got a little more--

MT: Match of what?

JT: The pattern, the pattern would be--

MT: Oh like it was a plaid or something?

JT: Yeah

MT: They usually, they were cuffed and laid, they were laid on the pattern to come out right.

JT: Oh, they just did them, it was automatically the way they laid them out that they would come out that way

MT: Yeah, yeah. Yeah but yeah that's--that would be how they did it to match, it'd all be figured out by engineers and all that set these up with the new styles and all. And oh goodness, they made so many different different items, you know, and every year of course they'd come out with new things and they would change the process a little bit and get going on them. There was a lot of things

JT: Well if, yeah it sounds like it. Did you ever do anything except button holes?

MT: Yes, yes when I very first started, I actually sewed and I was nine months pregnant and due to have my baby any day and I put a needle through my finger and I kept saying "I don't wanna go right now, I gotta do Christmas first" so anyway yeah, but yeah I did that sewing for a while and then I actually got to be--to where I could do several little things, I never did what they called the overlock machines, and not too much of the straight sewing. But as far as, you know, doing the buttons and the button holes and running the pairs and just, you know, helping out on the floor some and everything, I could do a lot of those different things.

JT: Why did you not do the straight sewing? Was that not quite as a specialty kind of thing?

MT: They just--that's not where they needed me

JT: Oh okay

MT: I guess after I came back, I was out for what, six weeks or so, and I came back and I think almost immediately they put me into doing, they called it tacking and it'd be like tacking bra straps onto a bra or something, they called it tacking and it would reinforce seams. So I did that a lot I think even before I started doing the button holes. But the button holes were tricky

JT: Okay, we'll get to them, but I guess I'm a little more interested in--

MT: The sewing part?

JT: The sewing part, yeah because--but you didn't really do any straight sewing.

MT: I didn't do that much straight sewing, like I did--at first I was, I was doing something I can't really remember exactly what parts I were sewing, but they had so many different styles and maybe you might work on one type of 00:13:00garment for a while and then later the day or even a day or two later you'd be into something else that was maybe a nightgown or a robe or a heavy winter robe and stuff like that, it changed.

JT: Did they make blouses and dresses and all kinds of stuff?

MT: No it was all lingerie

JT: Oh it was all lingerie, okay.

MT: It was bras and panties and robes and little gowns, and like I said winter type things too and sometimes some flannel gowns and, you know, they made sets, things that matched each other. Like you'd get a robe and a gown matched and different things like that

JT: Oh okay, and so--how many of the, back to the beginning of this where they cut the material

MT: Mhm

JT: And they had the foot layer of material, how many cutting tables did they have?

MT: If I remember right, they had maybe three and if anybody's ever seen the 00:14:00building, those cutting tables went at the back end pretty close to cross the width of the building

JT: So they were big tables

MT: They were long, long tables and wide, I can't say exactly how, but they were tall, they weren't like card table length or anything or even dinner table, they were taller. I don't remember that they--

JT: Work table, a work table

MT: yeah, yeah. But those tall knife things, I saw them do it a few times, I never did that. But the electricity came from the top down to the knife and it just, it just went through there and yeah. I mean they did a good job, I mean 00:15:00they were even, I mean the cutting never looked hacked up or anything like that.

JT: Hm, and so if someone had--let's leave the lid off of that, it won't crinkle so much while we're capturing it on--the, so how long would it take for a person to get through cutting out the pattern for one garment?

MT: Well you know I don't know as much as you can say because the way they laid those out, they were often times, there wasn't, you know, they may have all fronts in one area and all backs in an area, all sleeves in one area, or something, so I don't know. But I mean you could imagine those tables and even the biggest pieces for a nightgown were, what, five foot by three foot or something like that, you know, and they would just lay it on there.

JT: But when a person got, would a person that was cutting out these patterns, would they go through one set of material, the twelve inches thick of material

MT: Uh-huh

JT: And then that would all get bundled up

MT: Uh-huh

JT: And then would they cut out more the same day?

MT: They could, yeah

JT: So that--they wouldn't cut one time and that would be the whole thing

MT: It depends on what--how many they were intending to make. But yeah most of these came through when they started on a new garment or something, they'd come through for weeks and weeks the same garment, the same sets of garments.

JT: And really so what I'm trying to understand is the person doing the cutting, was it an 8 hour job to cut one pattern out through that whole--

MT: I don't know how long it took, I was never actually back there. I just mostly, when I was doing some of the running and stuff, because I usually worked up towards the front in the finishing part, so I never really got to watch that very often.

JT: Okay, okay.

MT: I would've, it was interesting, it was

JT: So they have the--

MT: I think there were three, seemed to me like there were three people that did that, cutting that I knew of, maybe there were three tables, I'm not sure how exactly that was back then

JT: Okay, and then when that left, it went to the first set of sewer. How many, I'm imaging this as long rows of people doing the same thing

MT: Uh-huh, yes

JT: The first is sewing and then they throw it in a basket in front and then another row of people with their machines and they turn around and get stuff out of the basket and do their thing and throw it in front

MT: Yeah they were big, big--

JT: How many people in a row, how many sewers--

MT: Well sometimes the rows, depending on what they were working on, sometimes the rows has more in them and sometimes they had less because a lot of it had to do with, like, if they were working on big robes and all, things had to have more room, you know, especially the big puffy ones and quilted and all that kind of thing. So things changed around but I don't know, like in the section where I 00:18:00did some button holes, and sometimes they moved things, rearranged, but I'd say there were maybe three or four button hole machines lined up and those didn't have to have a lot of space between them. So then there was the panty department was over to my right at one time anyway, and of course theirs all came from the panty department, it didn't take that much to do them so basically they were made--maybe, I don't know I'm guessing 8 -- 10 people that were maybe doing different things to the panties, you know, putting it together then adding the lace and the elastic and stuff like that.

JT: Oh and so that was from getting the pattern material after it was cut out

MT: Yeah [Indecipherable]--

JT: [Indecipherable]

MT: Yeah it didn't have to start at the back because there wasn't that many processes so it didn't have to start at the back.

JT: Yeah

MT: But, and they had--it was interesting, we had people come by to take tours and watch us and I had little kids that were really fascinated when I was putting on those buttons and those button holes, but there was a process and it didn't take that long to really do it. You went through that stuff

JT: Yeah, I can imagine that would, especially when you're doing the button holes and there's a machine there doing it, then you're--

MT: You have to measure them, you have to pull it out like you've got a garment in your hands and of course most button holes and things are in odd numbers, they're gonna be, you know, five or seven or something. But anyway you put the first button hole where it belongs and then you stretch, you pull the material 00:20:00to the left to a certain area, so a certain marking and then you do the next one and then you pull it and then you keep on until you get that and then you stack them back up and you throw them over on your table and then you get them all together and rolled up and bundle them up for the next person.

JT: Wow, okay

MT: Yeah

JT: Hm, interesting. And how many of you were making button holes? Three?

MT: Yeah probably something like that because some of us that did the button holes also did the buttons.

JT: Okay

MT: And there was, you know, and though the button machines were real close to where the button hole machine was, and I don't know, it was, what can I say? It just went

JT: It is--

MT: But these people, I don't know, everybody was good and friendly. Every once in a while considering you had that many mostly women that were in this building, every once in a while there was some ruckus going on, but basically yeah it was good, we had dinners now and then and you know, for occasions and celebrate peoples' birthdays and joked around some and all but you know, if you 00:21:00wanted to be there to work, you stayed at your machine and you didn't take a lot of breaks. You know, and then that paid off for you.

JT: Okay, so I was going to get to that, but first of all before I get there to talk about the--

MT: Processes?

JT: The, no the pay scale and how things worked

MT: Oh that was, yeah so all these different processes there'd be a piece of kind of a thin cardboard, and all of the processes were, how was it. Let me kind of start over, okay so you had this piece of paper more or less about the size 00:22:00of a typing sheet, and it told what that was, the size of it and everything and then down below I think there were pins on, I think two rows, and they were little printed tickets. Anyway you snipped that off with your scissors and you had this stuff called paper tape, it was actually a big big roll of brown paper, like wrapping paper that was sticky. And so if you didn't have a thing, a sponge to wet down, you licked them all. But anyway you wear them down and you stuck them on your paper and that's what you turned in for your work, that's what you did, how many of those you had on that paper. And that's how you got, that was called piecework.

JT: Oh okay, so when you got a garment, you got a robe and you had to put seven button holes on it, is that one of those little pieces of--

MT: No that bundle comes with its own paper

JT: That bundle comes with its own

MT: So whatever is in that bundle, the paper reflects how many is in that

JT: Okay so you pull that one off and then you wet it and you put it on yours--

MT: Yeah, you put it on your paper

JT: On your, yeah and you called it piecework, okay

MT: Yeah

JT: Yeah, okay.

MT: That's how you got paid for like, you know if you had a dozen in this one or some of them that were like thinner material could be a dozen and a half, the biggest heaviest robes a lot of times were only six in a bundle because, you know, they're big and heavy.

JT: But each one of those robes had the--

MT: Each bundle

JT: Each bundle

MT: Each bundle had this--

JT: Oh it was per bundle

MT: this cardboard with it per bundle and as you did your bundle, you know your one ticket's gonna cover everything you did in that bundle

JT: In the whole bundle

MT: In the whole bundle

JT: Got it

MT: So like I said, you worked and then you just kind of threw it over to the side flat and when you got done, they were kind of restacked and you went from one side to the other side by pulling it across your lap and--

JT: Did you have to wrap it back up into the bundle?

MT: Yeah then you rolled it back up

JT: You did, okay

MT: And there was a cordlike string stuff that they used. One string, it was 00:24:00more of a--just a fabric type something that you rolled it up--

JT: [Indecipherable]

MT: Yeah

JT: Okay

MT: and yeah you just rolled it back up then you tossed it in the box in front of you and the boxes were big, they could probably hold, I don't know, 20 or 30 bundles at a time even because they would be, oh probably three-foot-deep and four to five feet in width and maybe, I'm guessing 8 or 9-foot long

JT: Wow

MT: So yeah, so you had these big boxes and you tossed them for the next person to pick them up and go on with it

JT: That's, it's an assembly line

MT: It is, it's an assembly line. That's exactly what it is. It was interesting

JT: So if you were making, if you were doing six to eight thousand button holes a day, let's say that--I mean that's a thousand garments a day say if they had five or seven button holes.

MT: Yeah I mean it was, maybe I'm off by a big bunch on that button hole thing because if you have one bundle of a dozen and you're--yeah I may be off, it maybe it was 60 thousand. I can't remember, I remember I figured it one time. How many fabrics I did

JT: I thought you were gonna say you were overestimating, but you're saying you're underestimating

MT: I'm probably underestimating; I cannot remember exactly how. But I mean I would've done more than 10 or 12 bundles in a day. The button holes went fast

JT: So a bundle would have a hundred garments in it?

MT: No, a bundle could have a dozen, depends on what material it was.

JT: Okay

MT: How heavy it was, they could have a dozen, they could have a dozen and a half

JT: I see, okay.

MT: I guess there were some maybe come--the panties usually had I think two dozen or something

JT: Yeah

MT: But I didn't work those much, I did tacking on them though. So when you had 00:26:00an overlock string that was left, that wasn't actually looped in that were a stress point, that's when you tacked and you made this little zigzag tack the machine wouldn't do anything else except do that, I mean it was designed just for that.

JT: Oh okay, and you're just feeding the garment into it

MT: You just put what you want tacked under it just like you would if you were putting a button on it, you'd just stick it under there and do it and go to the next one and go to the next one and--

JT: Yeah, it's an assembly line

MT: The other thing that I did was, [Indecipherable], the other thing that I did for a while, we made bras. And so I had this process that I would, I can't think of the word. You take these bra straps and this machine held those little metal brackets and you had to feed these through a certain way to get the bra straps 00:27:00made. I mean, you had these long thin pieces of a ribbon type material and then the one end would be--had been sewed across, I'd done that one too, and you would take these little tiny pieces of strap and you'd fold it up and it'd go through your machine. And what you did, you just kept going, you just didn't do one and cut it off. You just fed one then you fed another and a lot of the processes in the back were the same thing. You fed what you did and the stitching, the thread actually held on and did the next one and then you went through when you finished, clipped them all apart.

JT: Okay

MT: It was, yeah kind of forgot kind of about that part but yeah. A lot of them 00:28:00it's just like those little strap things and then you'd go and you'd then, depending on which job you were doing, you'd feed those through these little metal things, and they still do, and it was pretty interesting and depending on how fast you got on that, you'd know how much you could make.

JT: Yeah, Okay. And so you were saying earlier about the pay scale and the way they counted, they had the counting system, which were the little tabs that you took off

MT: Mhm mhm.

JT: The bundle and stuck it onto your tally thing

MT: Yeah, and you knew, you kept your own tally of what you done for a day and you had it down in your little book and so when you got your check and it showed what you'd done, if it wasn't right you could take of it.

JT: Okay

MT: And you did

JT: And so was there a pay scale of--was it different based on maybe the material you were gonna do?

MT: Well they--that was set up by a technician who came by and a lot of times on 00:29:00my jobs, because I worked at a steady pace, and kept things going and a lot of the times I would be the one that they timed to set a rate and it'd be so much for whichever job that that happened to be. But I was timed a lot of the times on just about every job I ever did, I was timed on. But they had to have somebody who was consistent and--

JT: Didn't they have quotas that they expected you to do so much?

MT: Yeah, they wanted you to do so much and you know, if you fell behind well then the next person's gonna fall behind. But there were still people who liked to take long coffee breaks with their thermostats, you know, in the bathroom so-- but I thought, you know, how do you make any money if you're gonna go in there and spend 20 minutes a day. Of course, if you're fast enough, you're probably gonna make your quota and you've got that time if that's what you wanna 00:30:00do, so yeah it was work, it was work, but I can still remember it. To me, it was enjoyable to try to beat your own rate or something. Yup, it's a challenge.

JT: Okay, so you worked there 19 years, and you talked a little about your pregnant and you stuck a needle through your--

MT: Yeah

JT: Why did you go to work there?

MT: Well, it's just like anybody else. You're young and you're getting a family and sometimes one income just doesn't do it. And so you start looking around.

JT: Okay so you were, you started looking around for a job. It wasn't that you had a perplivity (ph) to do some sewing

MT: No no cause it's--there's so much of it that you would not call basic sewing

JT: No it was an assembly line

MT: Uh-huh, and I loved it, I always loved to sew and make my own clothes and stuff, but that was not like that.

JT: But did you think it was going to be when you went and applied? Did you think you were going to be sewing?

MT: No I really didn't know what to expect, but when you had to apply, they put you down to a sewing machine with a piece of paper with some, like, squiggles 00:31:00and curves and straight lines and all and that's what they looked at if you could do that pretty well you could get hired. But if you went all over the place and couldn't follow those lines, forget it.

JT: Well that's interesting

MT: Yeah it was, that was like besides the application, that was about the only real thing you had to do as I can remember.

JT: Yeah because being in an assembly line it seems like you're just moving the material to the machine and the machine's doing all the work.

MT: Well you have to guide it, there's the actual sewing part but you have to do a lot of guiding

JT: Okay

MT: Just like when I'm doing the button holes or something, I've gotta move it a certain length across there and then keep going. So yeah, and the buttons the same thing. You would just, you moved it over a certain length, so it was 00:32:00all--yeah, that's, you had to know how to follow those lines, especially if you were doing the sewing part.

JT: Yeah

MT: And most everybody I think started out on the sewing parts, that would seem to me if I could remember right that's a lot--and a lot of people stayed in that and that's what they did all the time was the sewing.

JT: Yeah, okay.

MT: Yeah

JT: So do you remember when you started?

MT: I started in something like March or April of 1964

JT: And how old were you? 22? 21?

MT: Hm, 1964, yeah I was--

JT: 21 and 8 months

MT: Probably 21, going on 22.

JT: Yeah

MT: That sounds about right.

JT: [Indecipherable], Okay. Did they, did they have things like team leads or 00:33:00bosses of an area?

MT: Oh yeah there were bosses in different areas that helped you, you know, if you needed help and make sure things are going smoothly and everything and yeah different sections had different people. Now I mean there wasn't like one person sitting there watching buttons and button holes and stuff like that, but you had someone that made sure things got, you know, flowed through right and everything. And some really good supervisors and stuff and I was even doing that for a while on some things, you know, just to make sure things were working right.

JT: Yeah, okay I was wondering if you ever did that.

MT: Yeah, like I said I ran the floor, I wasn't really a supervisor per say, I 00:34:00just, you know, if someone, if they needed me to do something I did it, that's all there was to it. If I could do it, I went and did it so.

JT: Okay, so--yeah I thought, sitting here thinking about how an assembly line worked like that, is that you would have someone, not a supervisor, but maybe a team leader

MT: No I don't know of anything like that, you kind of just did your own part and I guess if you fell behind and didn't do enough, then you maybe had a talking to or something, you know, if you couldn't keep up the work that needed to be done, like I said it had to go to the next person.

JT: Did you ever get a talking to?

MT: I don't think I did

JT: Did you admit it?

MT: My talking to was when they were gonna drop my raise, that was me talking.

JT: So, yeah that's kind of interesting that the way that would happen. See, to me that typically when someone they are entry level in a position, that they're paid entry level wages or entry level rates. And then as they get better and more productive, they get higher rates and--

MT: I think there was probably a minimum wage that you would do hourly, but basically it was the piece work. Now there were people who some of them who didn't do piece work that didn't even have the tickets or anything, they just had a job that they did for so many hours.

JT: Okay

MT: And yeah I mean there were some that were at that

JT: Yeah, okay. And so I guess where I'm--what I'm thinking about now is if people started getting hired to go out to the carpet factory, it seemed like did 00:36:00the orders start, did they start losing orders out there? Or--

MT: Well

JT: Because it, they could've just hired other people and kept them the same--

MT: Yeah, and they were still hiring at that time, but mostly they weren't because the carpet factory had come in and there they were cutting out rates. It was just like me when they got to me, but they started I think towards the back and, of course I was towards the front, and by the time that they got to me, there had been a lot of people had left.

JT: And typically if a company wants to keep a worker, they'd pay more.

MT: Yeah

JT: They don't come and say [Indecipherable]

MT: No, no.

JT: That's weird

MT: And they were cutting every bodies rates

JT: Huh

MT: I mean, they felt like with the price of what they sold these things for and all and how much it cost to get them through there, they--maybe they felt like they had to and maybe that's eventually what happened. But of course this was American made, American rates, and then you realize what started happening with 00:37:00all the stuff coming in from all the other countries, it just kind of blew it all apart.

JT: And so you talked about--also, earlier you talked about the label, the Miss Elaine

MT: Mhm

JT: Were there other labels too or just the one Miss Elaine

MT: Miss Elaine was it, now I think there was maybe a variation of what set on the label like luxury or I don't know, [Indecipherable]

JT: Yeah

MT: And I don't think I--did I ever tack on labels? They were just tacked on as the garment was finished, that was one of the final things I think. Some of those may have been put on before they were sewed, I really can't remember that part.

JT: Okay but it was all Miss Elaine?

MT: It was all Miss Elaine

JT: But different quality items

MT: But before I started it was called I think Artemis, Gossard Artemis (ph) from way way back, and then somehow it went to Miss Elaine

JT: [Indecipherable]

MT: I think that was actually after I started that it went to being Miss Elaine

JT: Yeah, the garment factory itself started operating in Bristow in the mid to late 50's, didn't it? So when you went to work for them, it was already--

MT: It was probably earlier than that. Well, I don't know.

JT: I've seen some pictures that show the garment factory in [Indecipherable]

MT: I don't really know, it was, it was quite a few years before I started because there had been some people who had been there already, I don't know, 12 or 14 years I think when I started.

JT: Okay, okay. And the Miss Elaine label, what stores carried that brand, that label?

MT: Whatever there was back then, mostly it'd be exclusive stores, you know

JT: High end

MT: Yeah, and like the Macys maybe, what's the big one in Chicago, and then there's Zac's and then there's I don't know. Yeah, that's where they went to.

JT: Wow

MT: That's where they went to, these were well made made in America and all this, you know.

JT: And I heard that Clarks in--

MT: Clarks had them, yeah. Clarks was one of the big ones, yeah

JT: Utica Square

MT: Yeah, and Clarks even when they were just downtown

JT: Oh

MT: Before they even did Utica Square in the early 50s, I think they already had one the way I understand.

JT: Wow, okay.

MT: Of course I wasn't there then, but just the different things I heard

JT: Yeah, so all the jobs that you did, did you ever have to fold the garments and put them in the boxes?

MT: No, I didn't have to do that. But there were some people who could, and they were on piece work too, that folding and there were some people who could fold those really nice and put those right down in that box and like I think like the panties a lot of the time there'd be like three in a box. And of course the gowns and all that, they'd just be one. Then those boxes were all stacked up over and then the shipping department would out them into the bigger boxes for 00:40:00transporting out

JT: Yeah, cases, cases of those little smaller boxes. It seems to me that someone had to pop those boxes into shape, that they would've come in flat and that someone would've had to--

MT: Yeah if I remember right as you did it, I had one very good friend that was a folder and as you did it, you just took that box, you know, and you've seen these flat boxes, they have these little creases on there and everything. You'd just take that flat box and you'd flip it around, put your garments in it, flip the top around, and--

JT: Right

MT: Generally, they weren't the attached tops that I can remember though, they were separate

JT: Separate, yeah that's [Indecipherable]

MT: Yeah

JT: Okay

MT: And you know, I didn't do that part so that's just what I saw

JT: Yeah

MT: Oh but she was fast

JT: I would imagine you'd have to be fast if you got--

MT: The thing about it was, you may want to put this in or maybe not, but that 00:41:00was Marie Shelton and she had that arthritis in her hands so her hands were getting--

JT: And it was from all that?

MT: It could be from all that, but she just got--she just kept at it and then I'm not sure how many years that they were still doing the folding, a few years, and then they went to the hanging. But I can't remember exactly hanging went--might have been quite a few years before, I can't remember. But yeah, then they went to the hanging and you know I don't know exactly what they did, they put plastic bags over them. You know, each one had its plastic bag, and then from there they went to the shipping department and I'm not sure how they--if they just laid so many in each big box or how they did that really.

JT: Yeah, okay. Well, so you mostly did button holes and buttons

MT: Tacking

JT: And tacking

MT: And the--I forgot about the bra straps actually, and yeah I did a few of those things. It was interesting though but especially when I think I was doing the tacking; it was like almost [Indecipherable]. I used to sit there and write poems

JT: Well I was gonna say a lot of times, and I learned this years and years ago, that people who like assembly line work, they like it because it's repetitious and they can actually think of things

MT: Oh yeah, you can--like I said I could've wrote novels. But I did write some poetry and what I used to write it on was that little brown sticky paper. And we all, most of us had our little radios with us and we listened to music and everything and, you know, nobody turned them up so loudly. Usually you could hear it right in your area. Because, you know, machines weren't like stacked on 00:43:00top of each other, you had several feet in between

JT: And did the machines make a lot of noise?

MT: Some of them did

JT: Yeah, I can imagine they did

MT: Some of them did, but it wasn't like the tremendous amount of noise, you know, it wasn't.

JT: Okay

MT: Yeah, it was--

JT: Was there a lot of movement of the workers from one section to the other?

MT: Yeah because a lot of the people had been there long enough that they did different things, and if they need someone else to go up and do something different, you know, they'd move them. Like, like if someone was--some of the processes where you almost sewed the whole garment together, then it went on to get finished. But there were a lot of people who could switch off and go do different things, and the people who did the hemming and stuff, there were quite few of them and those little rolled hem things, I mean they can throw those things through there and it just--

JT: The machine did that though, [Indecipherable]

MT: Yeah you just had to--

JT: Guide

MT: Guide the material through

JT: Yeah

MT: But you know, if you didn't you're gonna have big old chunks taken out where--there were a few things like an overlock machine, that most people don't know, maybe they do. [Indecipherable]. Anyway, the overlock machines, that cut off the edge of the material. If you ever looked at some of your things that are sewed, well you see these, there's no real seam, there's just this little tiny edging that holds the material together. Well that's an overlock machine, and that cut off material as it did, and so yeah if you went the wrong way, you could mess things up pretty good.

JT: Mhm

MT: And that's why ever once in a while you realize that you try on something, one fits different than the other, and it may have been the same size starting with, but it may have got adjusted a little bit unknowingly. But most of the 00:45:00time the inspectors, when they were inspecting, they could notice things like that that were really a flaw, you know, and they wouldn't, they'd just pull it out. But it was interesting.

JT: I've also wondered why that happened, because that happens to me, I don't know, it seems like a lot.

MT: Yeah, oh yeah. There's different things that you could try on

JT: Blue jeans and things like that

MT: Yeah, the very same size. I remember I was in the store one time and I went to try on a pair of blue jeans and I couldn't even get my foot through the leg, it was so narrow. And that was before they had narrow leggings. I thought whoa, this one go taken care of. No wonder it was in the seconds. But yeah, it's, that can happen real easy. So I never did overlock, I never did that one at all.

JT: What size is your foot? I'm just kidding

MT: My foot

JT: So, okay have we kind of been through the workings of the garment factory? I 00:46:00mean is there something that I didn't get to to ask you about?

MT: Well I'm trying to think of what, I mean yeah there is probably some things, I don't know exactly what, I mean like I said we all, we all got along really well. There were a few things, there were some jealousies going on and just different things could happen, and people would get kind of nasty. I had, maybe y'all will put this in, but I had one girl that, she was jealous because I made so much money, I made way more than her. She was doing the same job, and there was two of them and they were behind me. I even stepped back and showed them a better process, something--they were never doing the same process, but better way to move it or handle it or something to try and help them speed up. Then as 00:47:00soon as I'd sit back down at my machine, they were laughing behind my back because they slowed me down. So then this one, she would--she was behind me but a little bit over to the right and she would start asking me about my boys who played sports and how they were this and that and how they were doing and different stuff so I turned around and visited a few minutes. Well then they'd laugh because they slowed me down, they thought. It didn't slow me down much; I'd just go that much harder.

JT: Well did, maybe not your machine, but maybe your machine. Did they ever just break?

MT: Oh yeah, we had two really good mechanics and I think actually there for a while there was three, and you put up a flag at your place and if you were having enough of a problem and they didn't come soon enough, you got one of the four girls to go tell them what was going on because it was your downtime and if 00:48:00you wasn't doing it, you wasn't getting tickets. So you know, if you were down for 40 minutes, you could lose a lot of product there

JT: Yeah

MT: And so anyway, yeah it was--but they worked hard and they were--

JT: Never had the machine just blow up on you or anything?

MT: Yeah, never had them blow up, I did have--one thing I had was the button pole machine was, they couldn't get it to not skip and sometimes I'd see those button holes and as I'd finish I said, you know, it had a skip spot in it or something. Then I'd have to take that button hole and recenter that and try to hit it back in the very same place cause when that button hole was made, it also cut the hole. The knife came down and cut it just as it was made, so if I had to redo one, which I did redid a lots of them. Anyway, I had to try to set that where you couldn't tell that it'd actually been sewed over, and if it was bad 00:49:00enough, I had to pull the thread, but if you pull the thread, then the material didn't have--it was kind of looser right there. So when you tried to go around it, it lot of time didn't look any good anymore so, yeah it was--so anyway, that was part of the timing. When I was having a lot of problems with that, I'd get him to come out there and retime me I said and just, you know, stand here for two hours and watch what I do, watch how many times I have to redo these things, so that made a difference on my timing.

JT: Yeah

MT: So I'm sure other people did kind of the same thing, you know, if there was something that was troublesome they kept having a problem with some certain something. But that button hole machine, that was, I don't know, probably would be the worst for that, as far as having to redo something that quick. But yeah, it was--

JT: You never got a button hole needle to the finger, did you?

MT: No I didn't get that thing, I'm glad I didn't get that thing. But yeah that needle went right down through my finger and I was sitting there looking at it. Of course when you do it, you automatically jerk, so I mean it had broke it off when I jerked and there it was

JT: Was there thread in it?

MT: No, no I don't think there was thread in it. There was a lot of threads came through that you had to keep it threaded, but when I got it off, no there wasn't, but I don't think anyway. But I think they sent me out to the emergency room and had that, or maybe they just pulled it, I can't even remember for sure. I just didn't wanna have my baby yet because it was two or three days before Christmas and I had babies at home

JT: You thought that was going to put you into labour?

MT: Well yeah, and then it ended up that--cause Mikey was actually due on Christmas day, he was three weeks late. So there it was, almost Christmas day when that happened and I mean I just did not want to have him be in the hospital away from Steve [Indecipherable]. So yeah, it kind of shook me up a little bit.

JT: Okay, well did you ever, did you ever do things like dad did? Was there another plant? Was a Gossard plant that you would go--?

MT: There were other plants, but I never had to go to one

JT: You never had to?

MT: No, I think maybe, maybe, especially some of the supervisors or something like that, and I'm not sure whether the technicians that did the timing and stuff if they ever went to other plants to see how well they were doing a certain process, I don't know for sure on that. I just remember two different 00:52:00people that were [Indecipherable] of the technicians that worked with me and you know, of course when I was first started the first few years, no one ever come to time me for anything. But as I got into more and more doing different things and was doing good on that, then they come and time me.

JT: Yeah, who trained you?

MT: Who trained me?

JT: Who trained? Who trained?

MT: Well, if you went to a new job, you kind of just watched what they were doing and you were kind of showed that way the person who's already doing some of them, you just kind of watch them and then you sit down and try it for a little while and then you went after it

JT: That's when you did it, okay

MT: Yeah, I mean it--most of it, it didn't take a whole lot of training to do that or anything

JT: Okay, yeah.

MT: Yeah, you know especially since usually it was just like one more or less process, two at the most. Now doing these buckles on these bra straps, that was 00:53:00intricate because there had to be a certain way that you did this and this and this, and you had a foot thing or something that would raise them up and down, I don't remember how that worked. But man, I could fly through those things, they were--it was interesting though.

JT: Could you do six thousand buckles a day?

MT: I don't know how many I did, but I did a bunch

JT: Did you really?

MT: Yeah because you know, here you got a stack of bras coming through but there's gonna be two of these straps reach one and then you had the longer ones and the shorter ones I think, no I think most of them just had the one. They had it one time did some double or something. But anyway, it was--that was, and it was one time James, sometimes those little buckles down in this little tube they would jam up, so I took and I banged it into my hand and I tore up some tendons in my hand, I hit it that hard. I had some pretty good pain there for a while, 00:54:00but it didn't stop me or anything, I don't think I went to the doctor with it, but it did tore up my hand, it would just kind of freeze up and stuff. But you know, that's just part of it.

JT: Yeah, how many people worked up there in the production part? I don't mean supervisors and that, but do you know about how big the--?

MT: You know; I don't really know. There's some people who might know about how many were there; I'm trying to think of I can think of anybody right off who's still around. The ones that been there the longest, but yeah there for a while they were hiring quite a few and I guess it could've been in the neighbourhood of a hundred, 125.

JT: Okay that's what I was wondering because I didn't know. Around 100 or was it 200 or something like that?

MT: I think? No it wouldn't have been anything like 300, but I don't know if there'd even be 200. I would think an average season would usually have 75 to 00:55:00100 people

JT: Okay

MT: I'm trying to think of different rows and--but I don't know, I mean when you get to counting them, it's got to be around 100 I would say

JT: And so what's this--can you explain what the seasons were?

MT: Well you were always way ahead of the seasons so you were making things that were for the winter, you were making those during the summer time, and then you would get back into making the thinner, finer things that would go out for the spring and all and that's usually when you would start new styles and stuff, and then when it was gonna start on the winter stuff, you would have some new styles, sometimes the same styles and something else added

JT: Well when you said that there were 75 to 100 per season, so did that, did they--

MT: No I'm just saying during all those years, I think that the average would've been

JT: Okay

MT: As the year rotated, and all those years rotated, probably the average for 00:56:00any season would've been I would say 75 to 100

JT: Okay

MT: I was thinking how many people there were in just different areas, you know, how many cutters there were, how many sewers, how many folders or hangers, how many, you know, button holers, how many of the panties and just, yeah I would guess it would have to be something like that.

JT: Yeah, okay

MT: I Think there was five inspectors, five or six inspectors. They had tall table things and the tables were, they were angled and they were kind of thin slats with not very much room in between the slats, and they'd throw those things up on there and there was a bright light on them, and then they would go through and they would look at the button holes, look at the buttons, I guess they just to match them up, look at the hem wasn't wavy and, you know, just different things. And of course when the folders or the hangers, sometimes 00:57:00they'd get around there and they'd find something that got missed, you know.

JT: Mhm, sure.

MT: Yeah, it happened.

JT: So when they did that and when they went from to the next seasons garments, was there any downtime while they [Indecipherable] the machines or anything?

MT: No, no they'd usually start out a new season, if I understand it right anyway, they'd start out a new season, well they'd have to start at least one table would start cutting the newer stuff, or they may be finishing up on another table cutting, you know. And then they'd start and so then they'd just have a few machines over to one side that would maybe start on the rows or something and then--

JT: Okay

MT: Actually the robes stay towards the back because I know when I did buttons and button holes and tacking on the robes, I think I had to move back there to do some of them, yeah I'm pretty sure those--and they were so heavy too because 00:58:00I mean even if you got six or whatever they had in those bundles, that's big and it gets bulkier and heavier

JT: Depending on [Indecipherable]

MT: It's a lot to move around

JT: Yeah, okay

MT: So, I just remember that one time when I was doing some of the--I know I had to go in the back

JT: Yeah

MT: To do it, yeah I was--we were working overtime and it was a Saturday and usually we just worked until noon on Saturday, and they were needing some stuff done and I was working on these robes, and I was tired and I didn't really want to and I asked my supervisor, I said "I will come back after lunch if you let me bring my iced tea with me" because you're not supposed to have anything to drink, that's the deal, and she let me and I didn't spill it or anything, but yeah she let me. I said "if I can't bring my tea with me, I'm not coming back" so

JT: The store in Chicago

MT: Hm?

JT: The store in Chicago that we talked about earlier, Neiman Marcus (ph), was that it?

MT: Yes, I think it was

JT: Neman Marcus

MT: Because Jennet took me there one time, was just as much alter, but I was already at the back then. But anyway, I bought a Christmas decoration there and when I saw that, I remembered that was one of them that was on the list too

JT: Yeah, okay

MT: But I mean it wasn't, they didn't--I think the later maybe, they may have started going to a Pennys or not ever a sears I don't think, but Pennys may at one time have handled some of the Miss Elaine, much later though. But yeah when I started quite a few years to that, it was just these exclusives. There was a shop in Sharwood (ph), a town in Pennsylvania where my family is from, there was a little small shop, you know, exclusive shop and they had it in that shop

JT: Hm, yeah

MT: So yeah, that's the typical of where they were at

JT: Oh okay, is that Brams still around?

MT: I think it is

JT: Is it? Okay

MT: I think it is

JT: Wow

MT: So I don't know for sure, I know they had quite a few other factories at different places, but I'm not--I don't remember the, and I used to kind of know 01:00:00some names but I don't now remember where all they were. Missouri I think had one or two, maybe around Joplin or Saint Louis, somewhere up that way because it seemed like, seemed like our manager had to go up that way a few times or something. So yeah, there was some connections between with all the different plants, but I know that one time too I understood that sometimes they would do an entirely different items than what we were doing. You know, they might have a complete different line of [Indecipherable] and stuff like that than what we were handling, you know or buy them in different colours or whatever.

JT: Yeah

MT: Yeah, cause--

JT: Okay

MT: Cause lot of times, we would be handling three--when you start on a line, you would be, you know, on one--what am I trying to say? On one design, so you'd basically be working mostly on maybe one or two designs going through all the 01:01:00time, you know. You didn't have a whole bunch of different, so you did, you know, dozens and dozens and dozens of any said item, and that could go on for quite a few months.

JT: Mhm

MT: So, and I know if you went to the store and looked at Miss Elaine stuff, you saw stuff--I saw stuff that I had never seen before

JT: Mhm

MT: So, yeah. And we could, we were given the option of ordering things

JT: Oh from the other factory?

MT: Well for any, we could look in the catalogue and order anything, we could order things that we made, and then a lot of people in Bristow knew that they would sell their left over cloth sometimes, and of course we were right there so we got first chance to get anything, and laces and stuff like that when they quit using a certain lace, they would, you know, you could go back and if you want some of it you could buy it, and it was pretty handy.

JT: It sounds handy

MT: And I think there's some stuff of course as usual in any place like that that came out of there that wasn't bought

JT: Yeah

MT: That's just I guess normal, but--

JT: Yeah

MT: Yeah, there's still people who have some of these this material and all. I have a few little scraps of it, I don't have very anything really big anymore. But yeah, you know I'd buy these different things and it's like, yeah it was handy if you did any sewing at home, a lot of people did, you know. Back then a lot more people sewed, you know it was cool. So I mean we were, we were a good--we had all had good report with our supervisors and especially up where I was and everything. So this one time I was going getting ready to go to Pennsylvania and they took through about five or six different people back there, they took this one fabric and made me more or less a sundress, with no 01:03:00pattern, they just cut it and it just had, it just came up around--it had some sort of pattern, come up and tied on the shoulders and it had this big swirly skirt and they even put a liner to it and everything. That was the prettiest dress though, I wish I hadn't got rid of it, I mean it was almost like a dancing dress or something, it was just so neat. But yeah things would happen like that, you know, people were good, people were good. So it was a good place to work, I--and when I first changed jobs, I had a hard time not getting my old pickup not to end up up there at the parking lot instead of going downtown, I don't know how many times I did that. And then I dreamt that I was, I dreamt that I was doing my job at the bank, but then I was coming getting off at the bank 01:04:00early and coming out there and working for a few hours, I was doing both. It was hard to give up, I mean I didn't hate the job or anything.

JT: Yeah

MT: It was a challenge where at the bank it wasn't, there wasn't no challenge really. I mean just do your best, but you know.

JT: Was there any ever any talk of, or maybe it was, but was there a union out there?

MT: Oh yeah we were union

JT: Were you? Okay

MT: Yeah, I get a small pension now because I was there 19 years and not a lot but it comes in every month

JT: But did anybody wanna go on strike?

MT: No I don't think we ever did, there was one thing happened that one time and what was that? For some reason we did have to shut down and I don't remember all of the reasons behind it, but we all actually got unemployment and they set it up to where this unemployment place would come and I think we went to that, you 01:05:00know up here on 10th street? That white building? At 10th and chestnut?

JT: Mhm, yeah the community center?

MT: Okay, I think that's where they--yeah I think that's where they set it up, and so every week we had to go up there and of course I was one of the last ones to be off, but I was also one of the last ones to come back too. I mean we could all see it coming, and I don't remember why we were off, but we were off for like I think about 6 weeks to 2 months. Something like that, then we it gradually got going again. I don't remember the reasoning behind all that.

JT: It seems to me that they may have to retool every once in a while

MT: I don't know, maybe it-- I don't know, maybe the, maybe they just weren't doing as well or something, or maybe, I don't know what it really was. Maybe the orders weren't coming in fast enough or something, I don't know. I just cannot remember what that was all about, but then we got started back and then I'm 01:06:00trying in my mind to think how long was that before they started doing all this, you know, redoing everything on the rates and everything so I thought. It was probably at least a few years, maybe that was the ultimate thing they found out they had to do or something.

JT: Yeah I don't know

MT: Yeah they lost a lot of people, but lot of people went out there and ended up freezing stuff they shouldn't have and everything else, especially when it went to a lock plant and had that. Yeah I mean out there sometimes you get your allergies will kick up and stuff, and man I hate to take my allergy pill because sometimes that would slow me down a little, because I'd kind of get sleepy. You know, get up and walk around for a few minutes or something, go ask my supervisor if there's anything I could do for her for a bit or something, you know, but usually it did, it yeah, I didn't want to take that allergy pill.

JT: Well--

MT: There's so many dyes in it in that fabric and everything

JT: Oh most certainly

MT: Yeah, and then all the lint of course and everything

JT: Yeah it seemed like there'd be, yeah, particle matter in the air from cutting and stuff

MT: Yeah, oh yeah, yeah.

JT: It just, yeah [Indecipherable]

MT: Well I think, I'm pretty sure that the girls back there actually wore masks when they were cutting because of that and I don't think I ever wore--had to wear a mask or anything, but by the time it got up to me, the worst thing about that was those big big boxes, when you got toward the bottom of those big boxes to pull you out a bundle, there'd be these huge, huge spiders. Those big ol' grass spiders, you know, with the tan ones. Ugh I hated those things, I have nightmares

JT: Oh my gosh

MT: Because I hate spiders, oh I hate spiders.

JT: Wow

MT: Yeah I wished, I just happened to remember that too. There were things, there were things. But just, this is a part you won't want to put in there, but 01:08:00when we had the dinners, we knew who made what and we knew who's we avoided

JT: [Indecipherable]

MT: And there were two or three of those that we avoided, but there was some interesting food too, it was always good but still, yeah.

JT: Yeah

MT: Yeah, we had to, you had to

JT: Okay, well I'm not gonna ask--you know I really wanted to do this to get through how the garment factory worked

MT: Yeah

JT: And I think I've got pretty much a sense of the way things worked and the assembly line

MT: If I could add anything, I'd just--I don't know, you know, it just moved from the back to the front, there was separate machine shop. There was a separate place that worked up the laces and there was a, you know, different little processes that had to be done

JT: Yeah

MT: I mean some people had to sit there for hours and I don't, I'm not sure, I 01:09:00don't think they had tickets, maybe they did, I don't know. And they'd tie little bitty bows together, you know, all day long they were tying these bows, tying these bows. Yeah, I mean and these bows looked perfect

JT: They didn't have a machine that tied a bow

MT: No, but what you do is like you could do it at home, you take two nails and then you just wrap that around, flip it, and you're done.

JT: Oh is what they did

MT: But yeah, the nails make them all come out the same, so yeah. There's a lot of our things that had these little bows, little about two and a half to three inch bows, a lot of things had bows

JT: Yeah

MT: Yeah those ladies sit there and tied those bows and chatted and chatted and chatted, I mean.

JT: And then they'd be tacked on

MT: Yeah then they'd be tacked on, yeah I did a lot of tacking on the bows and yeah, that tacking machine was pretty interesting because it'd doo-doo, and it's done. Doo-doo, and it's done. I mean, just like, and what it does is it, I think it sews, it may sew one way and back straight and then zig-zags over

JT: Okay

MT: Yeah, and so like I said, if you could, you went ahead and just did one after another and then you had these little scissor things that you held in your hand and you just clip them like that, you know they weren't like big scissors, they were like clipper things. So everybody had their clippers and you protected your clippers. Because at that time, it wouldn't be a big price now, but you know, I don't know some of them paid $5 or $6 even back then, they may be cheaper now.

JT: You had to buy them?

MT: Yeah, yeah. So yeah you protected the clippers. But most people didn't ever bother anything, you know usually you could have--you could leave your radio there, you could leave your box of tissues and all this and--another funny thing in this one lady, whatever she, wherever she worked back there, and I can't remember what it was for that these things, whatever she did, she may have put on lace. Anyway, it had like masking tape in strips, and she started out this 01:11:00one time and put that masking tape together, and then she kept putting all her masking tape instead of just wadding it up and throwing it out, she'd stick it on this ball. She ended up with a ball as big as a basketball.

JT: How long did it take? How long did it take her to do that?

MT: I don't know, she was on for quite a while, I'd say a year or two, I don't know maybe longer. Maybe shorter, I don't know. But it was--it was, someone stole it.

JT: Oh wow

MT: Someone took her ball of this tape. It was sad because I mean, you know, you're--it's your work, it's what you've done, it's just kind of like, you know, meeting your goals or something, you know? You can see, right, exactly, yeah took her ball of tape.

JT: Wow

MT: No one ever did own up to it. But yeah that was kind of interesting, I think it must have been on lace or something, something that would've--that would've come unwrapped if it wasn't taped down. So that's what I'm thinking it was 01:12:00something like the laces or something, but yeah she had that ball of tape. Crazy. There was a lot of things happened out there though, you know, just different things

JT: Well, I think we've been at this for--

MT: How long?

JT: How long have we been at this? An hour?

MT: Almost two hours?

JT: An hour and 12 minutes

MT: Oh yeah I was here at 4

JT: Yeah

MT: Oh so yeah, but that--yeah, I've been here since, yeah.

JT: So Bug [Indecipherable]

MT: So you gonna edit that? You gonna put bug in there, are you gonna leave that?

JT: Yeah I think so, I think I will. I'll have to explain that, but--

MT: Well you can explain that, you can explain the family thing and all

JT: Yeah

MT: You know? And just say this is my oldest sister and whatever

JT: Yeah, yeah this is my oldest sister. My dad had a nickname for her, he called her Jane Bug because of the June Bug, and so that kind of got--

MT: Actually no, he called my Betsy. And that got started from Janet, so Janet 01:13:00started calling me, couldn't say Mary Jane so she said Mary Jane, and then my two brothers and my cousin decided it sounded like she was saying drain, so they started calling me drain bug.

JT: Oh, okay.

MT: It was Janet that did that, I just sent her a birthday card, I almost reminded her of that.

JT: Okay

MT: Anyway, so anyway they switched it to bug from Drain Bug

JT: You got shortened a bug

MT: Yeah

JT: Okay

MT: So yeah daddy actually did call me Betsy among other things I think, but yeah

JT: Well I heard him calling--there's several members of our family named Jane

MT: He's called Betsy

JT: No, the--

MT: Oh it's called Jane?

JT: It's called Jane, and I've heard him call someone Jane Bug

MT: Did he?

JT: Yeah

MT: I think he called your daughter Jane Bug

JT: Yeah, maybe

MT: Yeah

JT: That might've been it

MT: Yeah

JT: Anyway, okay well--

MT: Yeah and Janet did that same--instead of Jane she would say it sounded more like drain

JT: Mhm

MT: And yeah, Butch and Bobby, and probably Butch and Buddy mostly is the one 01:14:00that picked up on it

JT: Okay

MT: And--

JT: Okay well--

MT: And switched it

JT: Yeah, well I was gonna say thank you Bug for doing this, and--

MT: It was interesting to try to think of all this stuff

JT: Yeah

MT: That's why I hope I haven't left out any exciting for important things about it

JT: Well and you were there, this is what you remembered in your years there so

MT: Well I can tell you another thing that you may not put in there or not. Anyway this one time we were--we always had our radios right there and one of my real good friends was across from me and she was one that did the hanging so we could chat back and forth a little bit, but always had the radio. Well I listened to this one station out of Tulsa, and one of the pizza companies was giving out these tickets, and then they had these drawings every day, maybe even more than one a day, I can't remember it. Anyway, so we had our radios all tuned 01:15:00to this station so we could hear the numbers called. So we'd take our weekends and go to different pizza places in Tulsa and get tickets. So then instead of holding all tickets, we'd write our list of numbers down so we had this list of numbers. So this one time I had to go over to the IRS the day before, and really bugged me out even though it didn't cost me a bunch or anything, but just the whole thing had been traumatic and bummed me out. So there I was, it was in the morning and working away and everything and they were getting ready to call some numbers and I told Genie (ph), I said "I don't even wanna look" I was just, you know, kind of bummed out and everything and so they go to call these numbers and I told Genie, I said "That sounds like one of my numbers" so I grabbed my list, sure enough it was my number. So I ran to the front and had to use a payphone. Well I grabbed some quarters and maybe, I don't know, some people handed me a 01:16:00couple of quarters--you only had five minutes to call it in. So I run out there and they're looking at me in the office like, and I said "You can fire--don't fire me" but I said "You can clock me out or what you've gotta do, but I've gotta use this phone" and then you couldn't get the quarters to go in the slot, I kept dropping them. So anyway what I did was I won a record album a week for a year, 52 record albums

JT: Wow

MT: Yeah I've still got quite a few of those

JT: Do ya?

MT: Yeah

JT: Oh

MT: But, so then I let the boys go with me and this was already, I don't know, Steve would've been already up like in maybe even lower high school or something, I can't--Oh no, he was maybe a senior or junior because he was, that was another thing. This was out at the garment factory, he was probably early high school or you know, 8th grade or something like that. But he was already into music, so anyway I let them go with me and they could each one pick out so they had picked out some of them too, you know on that. But then, this other 01:17:00thing just telling me this, is it still recording?

JT: Mhm

MT: But you can take it off. But anyway this other thing, so I was down at the bank, and I listened to the radio station and you could call in and tell them your desk dancing song, which song would you get up and dance on your desk for. And I can't remember, it was of Neil Diamonds, and I called in and I gave it and they chose mine, and I don't know if you remember it or not, but anyway when I called and I was so excited that they used my voice for six months. They had me on there because I was so excited, Steve was in log doing the log and they had the radio on and they heard me too, so he knew it before I even got to tell him. But yeah, so then I had people come by and say, well because I was in that back window, "Well when are you gonna get up on that desk and dance?" It was funny, 01:18:00it was funny. But yeah it was a Neil Diamond, I can't remember if it was Cherry Cherry or one of those, I don't know, but it was a Neil Diamond song. But anyway, it was, yeah. And I won a shirt and a mug I think or something, but anyway. The things you do, you know, back in life you've done these things, it helps you get through life and everything, you know.

JT: Well, thank you again for coming up here and doing this

MT: You're welcome

JT: And we'll end this now

MT: Yeah you can [Indecipherable]

JT: I probably will